How YOUNG to start weight lifting...

[Jean-Paul]

I would like for this thread to be the official referral thread for ALL the times that I get questioned on how young a person should start lifting weights. I will continue to add to this thread, but for those of you in our esteemed panel who have links to supporting studies, and other proof that it is or is not okay for young people to lift weights, this is the place to do it. I don't have "stickies" on this forum (yet), but for those who want to check back in on this thread from time to time, just bookmark this thread.

Please include all the usual disclaimers, like "only if done with focus on proper technique" and all that stuff, so that we can make this a collection of good advice that will be a good place to start for all the parents out there looking for guidance, or all the 13-17 year olds wanting to "bulk up." Let's have it all!

I think a perfect place to start would the advice that Bill gave to a teen on the training forum... I believe it was a 3 week starter program. I will look for it and post it later, unless Bill has it bookmarked and wants to put it up himself.

[Bill Hartman]

It kinda depends on what you mean by weight lifting. From the time babies attempt to lift their head, crawl, creep, pull themselves to stand, and squat they are weight lifting.

I think the big issue is loading parameters. A lot of that can be determined by supervised "training" or play. Kids need to be able to control their bodyweight first.

However, I don't think you need to neglect the use of weight lifting exercises. For instance, what's wrong with teach kids to perform an overhead squat and pulling variations with good technique. What a perfect time to ingrain such movement patterns into such an adaptive nervous sytem. Rather than loading as the primary parameter for success, scoring technique can make for quite a competitive atmosphere in training groups (I'm a big believer in keeping score!).

As kids age, continue to focus on technical proficiency (in all aspects of training). Physical maturity will provide indicators of when loading may progress as does an analysis of response. Load to soon, Johnny may not enjoy the activity. This may be the best time to use non-conforming "weights" like k-bells, dumbbells, sand bags, etc. as they add a uniqueness to the "training" and keep kids attention.

Mid to late teens, kids will start to specialize (although they may play a variety of sports) and you can then start to look at more structuring of the "training program" and emphasize loading parameters on top of reinforcement of technique.

Brian Grasso will certainly have more to offer on this.

Bill

[Tin Man]

So Bill if I caught what you're say is that teaching technique with out load can begin at any age. So exercises like squats, lunges, pushups and other agility/coordination based movements can be part of a "play" program?

I am I on the right track?

[Jean-Paul]

Brian actually posted something on another forum that I really liked, and I hope that he posts it here.

The main reason I want this thread to exist though is that so many people have such an irrational fear of weights. I don't necessarily recommend starting an intense weight program for young children, but learning those movements, as Bill said, is beneficial when they are in that highly adaptive stage.

Also, I constantly read people's posts on other forums that their doctor's told them that if they started training with weights too early that they would damage their growth plates and stunt their growth, which is a myth that needs to be debunked once and for all!

Bill, that post you wrote to 15 year old boy several months ago would also be a great routine. Can you find that post and give that as a sample for teens?

[Tin Man]

JP...

How about pre-teens....your kids are in the same age range as mine...(5 1/2 & 2 1/2). My thinking and my wife too, is that it is never too early to build positive body image. Being that we have two girls I want them to know they can control their bodies in all aspects. The oldest is currently swimming and dancing. This spring it will be soccer & learning to skip rope (I'll be learning with her)

Should I be looking to build some core strength through some plyometrics What would be appropriate for that age?

[Jean-Paul]

Vin,
For my children I just do a wide variety of fun activities that just happen to work them out. At the playground in my neighborhood I will set up little obstacle courses. For example, there are three built-in tables, I will have them run, climb up the tables and jump off, run to the next, jump off, they have to wheelbarrow about 20 feet to a football, which they have to pick up, and run zig-zag around the cones, then climb up a net ladder to a platform, crabwalk to the slide, and run back to base. My son has not shown much interest in competing in sports like basketball, but he likes to compete against himself and try to improve his times on the various courses I will set up for him.

Another thing I do... Like me, my son LOOOVES those Jolly Rancher Gummies, but I don't want him to eat them since they are straight sugar, but if we eat some together, you have to do the exercise game. This is how I got him started doing push-ups, sit-ups, squats (no weight), push-press complex with little two-pound mini dumbbells (he really likes that one), jumping jacks, RDLs, jump squats... He gets one for every set of exercises he does. What's really cute is that my daughter, who doesn't even like the gummies, just watches us playing our game and gets excited to try what we are doing. She just turned three, and watching her trying to do pushups is one of the cutest darn things I have ever seen. I think she just likes to do what her big brother is doing.

I also wrestle with both of my kids a lot. They call it "fight game", which is more like "beat up on poor, injured old dad game."

The main thing is that I put no pressure to do this stuff on my kids. I was very frustrated at first, thinking my son was a late bloomer compared to other kids his age, but I took Brian's advice and wound up finding out what activities he really likes to do, and quit worrying about him playing organized sports. He will discover those at his own pace, but if (or when) he does, he will certainly be physically prepared!

[Bill Hartman]

Tin Man,

How 'bout gymnastics or martial arts??

Both require the acquisition of movement skills (balance, coordination, discipline (!))as well some serious relative strength for kids.

Hop scotch is plyometric, running is plyometric (tag, relay races, etc.), immitating animals is fun (okay, maybe just for me ), and trains shoulders, trunk, and hips in a variety of positions...oh, and kids dig it too.

"Championship Wrestling" with dad is always good too.

Bill

[Jean-Paul]

Bill and company, I finally found that thread. This was one of those classic posts that I wanted to refer people to on a regular basis. Here is what Bill told to a 16 year old young man with no injuries who was looking to build some muscle:

At your stage of the "game" you have several issues...

1. You are young (a good thing by the way) so as was mentioned by Silas you'll adapt to anything. This is absolutely true.

2. You are neurologically inefficient. You don't recruit a hell of a lot of muscle fibers at any one time. This is an adaptation which will come with heavier and more frequent training.

3. While you may be at a surplus caloric intake, it probably isn't enough. For "growing boys" the typical calculations for caloric intake are low estimates. In other words, you may actually be in deficit.

4. Your recovery ability is lower than you think. This goes along with your neurologic efficiency issue (all muscular adaptations are neuromuscular in origin) and your caloric intake issue. Unless you are a sloth during the day, other than your workout time, you also burn more calories from regular activities than the typical adult. This slows recovery.

With that in mind, consider the following:

1. To increase neural efficiency you must workout more frequently. One time per week per "body part" will slow down progress. Think at least twice per week. Your Mon/Thurs Tues/Friday split will work nicely. Train trunk muscles (chest, back, shoulders) on M & Th and Legs on T & F.

2. Increased frequency precludes you from training to failure. There is no research at all that states that you must train to failure to make maximum gains in size and strength. You must only achieve sufficient stress to cause adaptation in contractile units, energy storage, and organelle hypertrophy/hyperplasia. In fact, if you train too hard too often the organelles responsible for growth will not be able to keep up and progress will stop. Have you ever seen those guys in the gym who bust there ass to failure every set, every workout and never get anywhere? There's your answer.

3. Stick to basic exercises. Bench press, Rows, Standing Military Presses (not seated), Chins, Squats, Deadlifts, etc. Avoid attempts at isolation for the time being. It won't help. You'll recruit more muscle fiber in your basic exercises than any "isolation" movement.

4. Don't train arms, abs, calves, or forearms directly. Also, avoid aerobics like the plague. You need to give your body sufficient adaptation time. Now don't fret about the arm thing, you'll actually gain plenty of size. What does more for leg size/strength? Squats or knee extensions? Squats right? So think of the chins and presses as squats for your arms.

Try this for about 3 weeks:

Monday
Warm-up (general but no static stretching)
Explosive push-up 3-5 sets x 3 reps (start with 3 sets and increase by 1 set each week)
Bench Press 3 x 7,5,3
Dips 3 x 4-6
Plate Drops 3-5 x 3 (quickly pull a plate to your chest like a bent over row and drop it, but catch it before it reaches arms length)
Chins 3 x 4-6
BB Rows 3 x 7,5,3
Standing Military Press 3 x 7,5,3
Go Home at eat!

Tuesday
Warm-up (as monday)
Jump squats 3-5 x 3 (same progression as the push-ups with 30% of your best squat)
Back Squat 3 x 7,5,3
Romanian Deadlift 3 x 7,5,3
Go Home and eat

Thursday
Warm-up
explosive push-ups
Bench Press 3-5 x 8-10 (3 sets week 1 and add one set each week)
Dips 2 x max reps
Plate drops
Chins 2 x max reps
BB rows 3-5 x 8-10
Standing Military Press 3-5 x 8-10
Go home and eat

Friday
Warm-up
Jump Squats
Back Squat 3-5 x 8-10
Romanian Deadlift 3-5 x 8-10
Go home and eat

Week 1 intensity 2-3 reps shy of failure
Week 2 intensity 1-2 rep shy of failure
Week 3 intensity the set ends on the last rep you can complete without cheating or assistance.

Rest periods between sets should be 3-5 minutes for heavy sets and 2-3 minutes for lighter sets.

Adjust weights upward each week to accomodate intensity changes and strength increases.

Follow week three with a week of "easy training" with intensity similar to week 2

Try it, you'll like it. Then you'll be ready for the next step.

That advice appeared in this thread: http://forums.jpfitness.com/cgi-bin/...c;f=2;t=000220 which is well worth going back and reading... There were several morsels in there.

[Bill Hartman]

Keep in mind that our young friend was not an absolute beginner (to the best of our knowledge anyway).

Bill

[Kaiser]

Here's a serious question JP, since we both have kids of similar ages. Why do you want to get your young kids weightlifting? Isn't (playful) activity enough? Frankly, for my kids, their aren't enough hours in the day for active play...so why would I want to burden them with a weight lifting program? At ages 5, 6, or 7, their bodies are set up to grow and build muscle (unlike their dads, who have to lift just to stave off muscle loss) just through everyday 'kid stuff' (without getting into the entire sedentary kid due to video games/TV issue).

It's been a long time since I read something on this issue, but for some reason I remember reading that pushups, situps, jumping and running ('plyometrics'). pushing other kids, etc were good resistance workouts for young kids, but that lifting heavy weights ('heavy' must be defined) was not recommended because their soft tissue structures were not thick enough/strong enough to handle it. Please comment on that as well. Thanks.

[Tin Man]

Thanks Bill.

We do our share of rough housing...I get the "beats" regularily. The martial arts sounds like a great idea since there is a Tea Kwon Doe Dojo (sp?) a few minutes from my house. The big thing for us right now is cost. she will stay in swimming but it is to find other things to do during the winters here that I'm concerned about.

As an aside last night I had tmy 5 yr old out skating for only the third time and she did it without the aid of the rack (chair like thing to aide in balance)and spent the next 45 min "skating" around...definite "proud" pop moment.

[Jean-Paul]

The exercises they are doing are not actual weight bearing exercises. They are just doing the movements, and a much wider variety of exercises than I listed. Nothing has enough weight to push their muscles even close to failure. Plus, the programs are not really all that organized or regimented. He has to do some acitivity if he wants gummies, for example. Most of our play is tag, light saber sparring, some soccer (just kicking and chasing the ball, no rules or structure yet), wrestling, or climbing. The main thing I do is just try to keep things fun. I have learned that my son likes to challenge himself, but he is really inhibited if there is competition with other kids or an audience involved. Let me tell you though... The boy can flat out RUN! The day he decides to not be afraid of competition or performing, he will be out there in front of everyone. His gait is really natural and flowing.

[Kaiser]

"Light saber sparring"... we've got about 7 light sabers at home and those things on the knuckles HURT! [img]redface.gif[/img]

[Jean-Paul]

I know that Brian Grasso is busy as usual so I lifted this little excerpt from one of his posts because some of it is relavent to this thread:

Any movement you train should involve full ranges. If there is a weakness or current impinged condition, then seek help from a corrective standpoint and then resume full ROM activities. Shortening ranges, especially with young athletes, can lead to what I have heard noted as 'incomplete strength'. I kinda like this term. The body has natural ranges of motion, and to limit those ranges during strength training has a reciprocal limiting effect on performance. Also... Why the towel? If this coach is intent on limiting the natural ROM, than why not teach athletes to eccentrically control and stop the weight at a desired angle and then proceed upwards?

This is much like the 'only squat to 90' thing. First of all, at 90 degrees, the knee joint is at its most unstable position... Why stop a movement their? Secondly, your body will need to exhibit both strength and recoverability well past 90 degrees knee flexion in both sport and life. Why wouldn't you train it?

With the power lifting question - Yes, 14 year olds can certainly perform power lifts. There are however, several issues to maintain:

- Form has to be the number one concern, not load.
- Volume needs to be controlled and monitored.
- You NEED a coach with a GOOD background in teaching power lifts who can break down movements and provide appropriate feedback.

Don't let power or Olympic lifts scare you from a chronological perspective. I often teach the concepts and techniques to kids as young as 8 - 9. The nervous system is like a road map of experience - teaching concepts and movement patterns at an earlier age will only facilitate good habits in the future. ALWAYS look for technique and skill over volume and load, however.

[JaW]

How young are you guys talking about? I'm 15 and I lift and I am playing football next year so I think it is kind of a necessity..'Cause some kids are just naturally bigger then me..Anyway, there about 30 of us lifting 4 days a week, I like lifting its fun for me I like watching my gains.. I remember when I was 9 and tried lifting and I was benching 20 lbs hehe. Lol, I just wanted to share that with you guys..

[Brian Grasso]

My VERY quick two cents...

There really is no age that represents the minimum requirements for young athletes to begin lifting weights. Successful lifting technique is a product of advanced (perhaps 'capable' is a better word) CNS development. Once a child exhibits appropriate motor control, than the prescription of weight lifting could theoretically be applied to their weekly training/activity schedule.

There is also no real concern from a developmental muscular perspective. We encourage youngsters to run and jump - both dynamic activities which result in significantly higher GRF than any weight training exercise. The structural and muscular systems are certainly taxed more during basic movements like this than they would be during weight lifting exercises.

In terms of why, there is strong evidence that supports the NEED for weight training based exercises with kids in their pre-pubescent years. First of all, any well coached youngster will develop advanced technical skill by engaging in weight lifting. This technical skill will pave the road for safer and more advanced lifts in the future (kinda like math... we teach math as a developmental skill over ascending grades. The math we are taught as youngsters only really serves as a foundation for the specific math we will learn later. Without the foundation though, it is nearly impossible to grasp more difficult concepts. Same holds true for lifting/speed techniques. Plasticity of the nervous system allows for the most gains to occur in younger athletes. Don't limit those prospective gains be waiting until the teenage years to start teaching good habits).

Also, it has been shown that in young children, high VOLUME (low LOAD) strength/power training can increase the strength of connective tissue (ligaments etc.). This is of paramount importance if you are going to engage in power/strength lifting later in life. Same kind of 'foundation' concept