I do have a couple of thoughts. One niche market for kids would be to set something up that would appeal to those who are not athletically gifted or just plain not into competition sports. My daughter in her younger years was always physically active but definately did not like sports. She did like things like obstacle courses, bicycling, gymnastics but only for fun not competition, swimming, scavenger hunts, games, etc. Setting up things where kids are working alongside each other but not always in direct competition with each other. For those kids I would definately recommend limiting the class size. Smaller groups are more comfortable for those who feel clumsy or having trouble "getting it".
Also maybe set up some classes where kids could try something for 3 months just for fun. My daughter once wanted to try hip hop dancing just for fun. I could not find a class for her. I live in the pacific northwest I thought that was absolutely ridiculous that what with all the dance schools out here they couldn't bother to offer an occasional class that wasn't on the competive competition level!!!!! They were all geared for those who are and will be dancing for years. In other words this was their sport. And even when I did find one that would kind of work the cost just for their dress code was prohibitive. I don't want to spend several hundred dollars on the "look" when all she wanted to do was to learn a few moves and have fun for a couple of months. She wasn't interested in being on stage. Anyway that's kind of long but it does kind of illustrate the point I'm trying to make and another potential market area.
One area I don't think you've mentioned marketing to is the homeschooling families. Sometimes their money is tight but they will spend the money on their kids education and the parks and rec homeschool PE and homeschool swimming classes are popular around here.
I'm not sure how well this would work for you but another fun thing for kids is the dance dance revolution and other similiar video/nintendo games. That's actually my daughter's preferred form of exercise all through junior high and high school. We have several dance mats and anytime the kids have a party she's asked to bring all that stuff and so the kids are doing that all night. They swap off and it's a physical activity the kids have made work for a group even with limited mats and such. I know there are places that have DDR set up for a group class so I know it's possible. I wouldn't think that would be practical for now when you're starting but later as your business grows it might be something to consider.
So far everything you've brought up all sounds good. Not that I'm a fitness or business expert by any means.
Wow, thanks for that, D. Lemme see if I can address a few things:
Competition
--There is none. This is especially important with older girls since they have a tendency (over other sub-populations) to get into a competition with each other over who did worse at something, especially after a lost contest. Fun is first, socialization is second, teamwork is third (that'll vary depending on the day).
Slow developers
--That's a key reason why the age groups are broken up into 5-9, 10-13, and 14-18 with a case-by-case overlap at the edges. I've also toyed with offering a "special populations" course (not the actual name, of course), which would focus on special-needs children with various disabilities. No one is pushed beyond their limits or expected to act and move like an adult.
Free trials, program length, dress code
--I'll initially be offering a free single session where the child(ren) and parent(s) can participate together (or just the child with the parent watching), which will be followed by a brief presentation and Q&A. I only offer programs in duration of three months and one year (plus pay-per-session drop-ins) so that (a) participants won't be roped into a long-term commitment if they don't want to be and (b) they'll be in a program long enough to actually see some long-term results. No "Six Weeks to Sexy Abs" here. And dress code? Please, we're going to be rolling around on the floor/ground getting dirty and sweaty. I don't care just so long as it's comfortable and unrestrictive.
Homeschooling
--That's certainly on the radar; in fact, that was the first group I started researching. My hesitation there is how to approach this group (along with other already-formed groups), which won't be an issue once I get all my material together and organized. In this region--and especially in this corner of Charlotte--there are a ton of homeschool organizations. I'll also be approaching charter and private schools; public schools are way down the road.
DDR et al
--No video games or anything else involving technology here. There will be plenty of opportunity for group exercise and activity that involves actual person-to-person interaction rather than focusing on a TV screen. Plus, I have a particular aversion to DDR since many kids (and adults) don't know how to properly jump or land in the first place, so all that up-and-down ends up pounding the heels--almost mandatory to active that game pad--and transferring shock through the ankles, knees, and hips; proper technique would be solely on the balls of the feet and using the Achilles to absorb the energy, but that usually requires some measure of coaching, especially in younger populations (in older ones, it's usually a matter of inadequate strength-endurance).
*whew*
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Cotter qigong x 5
hip PNF x 5/side
shoulder PNF x 5/side
ankle glide x 5/side
Block #1: 10min = 13 full rounds
--1-arm KB swing x 2/side @ 12kg
--burp x 6
60RI
Block #2: 10min = 16 full rounds
--sledge swing x 5/side
300RI
Block #3: 5min = 14 reps
--tire flip
incline push-up "plus-only" x 20
standing YTML x 12 ea
Notes:
--I'd never done this workout before due to equipment needs, and man, how awesome was this! I. Am. Fried. And now I have numbers to beat next time.
--I may've gotten seventeen rounds on the sledge swings, but I lost count at some point during one round--I was doing well to minimize my downtime.
--I took the extended break between Blocks #2 and #3 because I wanted to make sure I was recovered enough to handle multiple tire flips with good form (nevermind the wussy rep count).
--Depending on the workout, I'm going to start adding some progressive shoulder p/rehab stuff at the end as suggested by John Izzo yesterday. It doesn't take much to tweak it anymore, and I know it's limiting some upper-body strength potential (not to mention ROM).
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As the mom of a very small boy, I like your flexibility in age groupings - DS is the same size as kids 2-3 years younger and it can be an issue in some sports for him (like sparring when he's 75# and the other boys his age are 130#!)... Taking maturity and size into account would be a big plus, IMHO...
Wow, sounds really great. You're definately thorough and planning ahead. Too bad you live 2,000+ miles away from me.
Good point too Bytsi. I ran into that a lot when DD was little--she was a 2 lb baby and it took her many years to catch up size wize to her age. The reverse is also true for those kids who are bigger than average. They may look like a 10 year old but they're really only 7 sort of thing.
circuit x 3, 90RI
--static inchworm x 5
--standing KB twist x 10/side @ 18kg
--back bridge x 30sec
--hanging knee raises x 5
Notes:
--Rope skipping (and occasionally rowing) will continue to be my interval training so long as I'm not running (I really should make a doctor's appointment so I can get a referral to get an X-ray; we'll see). As such, regular skipping with varying footwork will be the longer "laps" while double-unders will be the 50yd "sprints." When I get to the 100yd "runs," I'll probably stay double-footed, just at a much higher intensity for shorter duration.
--I was going to work on my IYCA exam some more today, but only a few questions into the next section, I found yet another error in the exam (couldn't select the correct answer from the embedded pulldown menu in the PDF). I thought I'd try to edit it in Adobe Designer since that's kinda how dynamic PDFs are made and succeeded in blanking the whole thing, so I had to re-download a blank exam. I'll be including a letter of explanation on several bad items when I do submit the exam. Kinda at an impasse on the actual business-side stuff right now, just lost some steam temporarily. May need more coffee.
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As the mom of a very small boy, I like your flexibility in age groupings - DS is the same size as kids 2-3 years younger and it can be an issue in some sports for him (like sparring when he's 75# and the other boys his age are 130#!)... Taking maturity and size into account would be a big plus, IMHO...
Quote:
Originally Posted by dianas
Wow, sounds really great. You're definately thorough and planning ahead. Too bad you live 2,000+ miles away from me.
Good point too Bytsi. I ran into that a lot when DD was little--she was a 2 lb baby and it took her many years to catch up size wize to her age. The reverse is also true for those kids who are bigger than average. They may look like a 10 year old but they're really only 7 sort of thing.
Ditto to both of these. Until this year had a very small son who was <2 lb at birth and took until he was 13 to catch up to the average kid. Also have a daughter who is going to be 10, but looks 13. People expect her to be able to do things with her long arms and legs, but she has no real athletic control of them.
I understand your dress code, but you might want to have something about earrings, especially dangly earrings. In wrestling and basketball around here, earrings are not allowed for girls or boys during their practices and games. Of course this only matters if it's any kind of a contact sport thing, but I wasn't sure because of the "rolling around on the floor getting dirty and sweaty."
I'd assumed the "no jewelry etc" would be an unwritten rule, but good point bringing that up. I'll make sure to blatantly mention that as well--I guess it'd be smart to assume nothing *facepalm*
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I'd assumed the "no jewelry etc" would be an unwritten rule, but good point bringing that up. I'll make sure to blatantly mention that as well--I guess it'd be smart to assume nothing *facepalm*
Yeah... don't assume anything.
In our women's self defense classes, we explain that we'll be teaching wrist-grabs, chokes, etc... and then have to REPEATEDLY ask them to remove rings, watches, earrings, necklaces... And these are (allegedly) adults
* denotes set done with hands interlocked overhead
** denotes chin-up grip
Notes:
--I quasi-combined and modified the first two movements into one to both save time and reduce risk to the shoulders. I tell ya, swing a KB to straight overhead takes a bit more of an oomph than just horizontal swings.
--Pistol squats just weren't happening today, even though I tried about a half-dozen times, so I opted for a mobility emphasis over strength; same for the second part of the superset (and final tri-set), but that's mainly because I don't have anything built (yet) to do manual hamstring curls (my wish list does include a GHR bench).
--More reading today, and the more I read, the more ammo I have for the IYCA's education director. The textbook's editing is truly wretched in every sense. Vudu continues to give invaluable feedback on my questions and comments, which is making me feel a lot better about the whole thing (not to diminish the truly priceless responses I get here, of course)
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hour-plus walk with dogs
hip PNF x 5/side
shoulder PNF x 5/side
ankle glide x 5/side
circuit x 4, 60RI
--burp x 30sec
--jumping jack x 30sec
--split jump x 30sec
--burp x 30sec
--jumping jack x 30sec
--BW squat x 30sec
circuit x 3, 90RI
--flag negatives x 5
--standing KB twist x 8/side @ 18kg
--DL twist x 6/side @ 18kg
--back bridge x 30sec
Notes:
--I have to say that I've been wary of doing no SMR or flexibility work lately, but it seems that my mobility and PNF stuff is keeping things in order so far. Still keeping a very close eye on things in that regard.
--I was supposed to do two completely different movements in the core circuit, but I was so out of it by then that I just went with what I ended up doing on the first circuit.
--Do you know how hard it is to burp for thirty seconds solid?
--No biz stuff today other than mulling over the whole SASE thing on the surveys: do I address them to a rented PO box, or since the first round will be just in my neighborhood, do I address them to my house so that the people who look at them see a nearby neighbor and maybe are more likely to fill out and mail in the surveys? Still leaning toward the PO box, but just a thought. I've all but decided to initially do the surveys on paper since it's a hyper-local thing to start, then I'll get the online survey going whenever I get the website up and running (a project I'll likely farm out if anyone's interested).
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What's a two legged pistol squat? I read your notes but still don't get it. And also, those circuits make me tired! So stop it.
Poor notation on my part. I should've said "feet-together squat." I had pistol squats logged and just added "two feet" to it, so when I copied it here, I wasn't thinking so much as, well, copying (my core circuit notes were more detailed, hence no boo-boo there).
Today is supposed to be an off day, but I may go flip the tire and/or climb the rope just because. Maybe make up a circuit or two
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hip PNF x 5/side
shoulder PNF x 5/side
ankle glide x 5/side
Tabata
--Thera Band shadow boxing x 8
--BW squats x 8
--Thera Band shadow boxing x 8*
--burps x 8
* denotes last three intervals done as burn-outs, not shadow boxing
Notes:
--Tabata good because you really don't have time to think about how tired you are, what craptacular sleep you just got, or what time of the day it is. Tabata bad because, well, Tabata Tabata.
--Normally, I would've warmed up a little more for this, but (a) it was pretty short, and (b) it's already so humid outside that I was sufficiently warm halfway through the first round of shadow boxing.
--Speaking of, the workout calls for heavy bag work, and of course I don't have a heavy bag. I do have heavy gloves (18oz, I think) but nowhere to hit (considered the brick chimney--no hooks--and rope-climbing tree--no flat ground), so I doubled over my thickest stretch band (a generic grey one that is stronger than any two of the three "light" Thera Bands I have), hooked the handles onto each each, brought it around my back and under my armpits (had to put on a sleeved shirt for this one), and proceeded from there. It doesn't offer the same kind of satisfaction that bag work brings, but it's a decent substitute for now.
--June kind of slipped away on me, so this coming week will be PO box rental and a very simple website going online (will steal server space from work for the time being). Survey creation will follow with distribution right after July 4. I did scout a nearby park the other day, and it'll be perfect in good weather, but there are no picnic shelters, so I still need to find a bad-weather venue.
--I can't read or say "Tabata" wthout it coming out like "bonzai!" or "Yatta!" Sad, I know.
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Not sure if that's something I want to officially deploy, though. It seems a bit too generic, but I'm sure that's the point. Elsewhere in Google Docs, I've been compiling a boatload of more relevant (I think) questions. Just a cut-and-paste job here:
Quote:
--Which describes your gender? male, female, prefer not to answer
--Which describes your age group? under 18, 18-24, 25-34, 35-44, 45-54, 55+, prefer not to answer
--Do you have children in the house under age 18? yes, no
--What is their age range? (check all that apply) 0-4, 5-9, 10-13, 14-17
--Are they involved in sports or other organized physical activity outside of school? yes, no (if "no," skip to section)
--Which season(s) of the year do they play, practice, or compete? (check all that apply) spring, summer, fall, winter
--How often do they normally play, practice, or compete? daily or almost daily, a few times a week, once a week, a few times a month, once a month or less
--What times of the week do they normally play, practice, or compete? (check all that apply) weekend mornings, weekend afternoons, weekday mornings, weekday afternoons
--Why does your child(ren) participate in sports? (check all that apply) competition, socialization, physical activity, other
--Which of the above reasons is most important to you? competition, socialization, physical activity, other
--Have you ever paid for sport camps or other non-competitive training services for your child(ren)? yes, no
--How would you rate your experience with these services? Excellent, Good, Fair, Poor, Bad
--How would you say your child(ren) rated their experiences with these services? Excellent, Good, Fair, Poor, Bad
--How far do/would you drive for your child(ren)'s sports activities? 0-5 miles, 5-10 miles, 10-20 miles, 20+ miles
--How does/would inclement weather (rain, snow/ice, excessive heat, high winds, etc) determine if your child(ren) participated in sports indoors on any given day? not at all, somewhat, likely, definitely
--How does/would inclement weather (rain, snow/ice, excessive heat, high winds, etc) determine if your child(ren) participated in sports outdoors under shelter on any given day? not at all, somewhat, likely, definitely
--How does/would inclement weather (rain, snow/ice, excessive heat, high winds, etc) determine if your child(ren) participated in sports outdoors exposed on any given day? not at all, somewhat, likely, definitely
--Would you be interested in play/exercise options where you could participate with your child(ren)? yes, no
--Would you be interested in play/exercise options where you could participate near but separate from your child(ren)? yes, no
--Would you be interested in play/exercise options for adults only? yes, no
--Which describes your marital status? single, living with partner, married, separated, divorced, widowed, prefer not to answer
--Which describes your highest level of education? less than 9th grade, some high school, high school diploma or equivalent, some college. associate's degree, bachelor's degree, graduate or professional degree, prefer not to answer
--Which describes your household's yearly income before taxes? less than $25,000, $25,000-49,999, $50,000-74,999, $75,000-99.999, $100,000 or more, prefer not to answer
--Which racial/ethnic group best describes you? white/Caucasian, Hispanic/Latino, black/African-American, Asian, Pacific Islander, Native American, other, prefer not to answer
Just kinda casting lines right now--the way my brain is (mal)functioning today, I figure I'd just write down all the questions I can think of and then pare them down to something more focused. Any quick hits on what to add/edit/delete?
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Notes:
--Wait wut? A two-a-day? Well, it's like this: it's summertime. I'm talking about fixin' to take my fourth shower in forty-eight hours. So, after this morning's workout and shower, then riding to and from work, another shower was in order. Considering that I might--MIGHT--have time to get in the second half (core circuit) of this workout between work shifts tomorrow, and in doing my best to keep my showers from becoming regular two-a-day affairs, I went ahead and blew this one out despite yet another night of iffy sleep and subsequently being a zombie all day today. I knew I could get the rope work done on no rest, but the core circuit just ain't happening.
--Biz-wise, I was hoping to get website stuff rolling today, but the brain wasn't cooperating, so after trying to (unsuccessfully) create a flyer, a business card, and do some reading, my brain started vomitting survey questions (see previous post), so I just went with it. After all, there's no point in trying to hold back vomit: it feels worse keeping it all in and hoping your body will purge itself peacefully than it does to just get the catharsis over with, deal with the bad taste in your mouth and bad odor in your nasal cavities, and just hope tomorrow is a brighter day. Can you tell I'm not all here?
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Okay, ix-nay the above survey link. I've spent most of the morning absolutely rolling through a Google Docs survey. It needs a little more work, but chances are the link can go live later today or tomorrow for user testing, then later for actual market testing. The best part is that it's exportable to several document formats, making it easy for printing.
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This is the comprehensive survey (hosted on Google Docs). If you're so inclined, please look it over for readability, relevance, redundancy, and anything else I might need to add/edit/delete. Please do NOT fill out the survey, just look it over. I'd rather not have to sift through irrelevant data later on
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How are you getting people interested enough to do the survey? If you could get some sponsors, local sports stores, food places, etc. to offer you some coupons or free visits, etc. you could offer that up as incentive.
It's really long. Section 4 is particularly daunting from an "I just give up" perspective. You ask about "the service" many times, but it's not really clear what the service is.
I don't think much of the answers will dramatically effect what you are going to offer, especially until they actually try what you have to offer. They don't know what they want, you have to sell them on what they want.
You have FAIR/NEUTRAL listed as a possible value - to my mind they don't mean the same thing. I'd suggest using Excellent, Very Good, Good, Fair, Poor or Excellent, Good, Neutral, Fair, Poor. In the same vein, DON'T KNOW/NEUTRAL are two different responses, and should be split out (and I would probably change NEUTRAL to NO OPINION).
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How are you getting people interested enough to do the survey? If you could get some sponsors, local sports stores, food places, etc. to offer you some coupons or free visits, etc. you could offer that up as incentive.
It's really long. Section 4 is particularly daunting from an "I just give up" perspective. You ask about "the service" many times, but it's not really clear what the service is.
I don't think much of the answers will dramatically effect what you are going to offer, especially until they actually try what you have to offer. They don't know what they want, you have to sell them on what they want.
Why thank you
I already figured Section 4 was a bit much, but I also figured I'd include too many questions to start and pare it down to maybe half. Any particular type/style of question that seemed too tedious?
As for "the service," I'm going to replace that phrase with something like "youth-oriented fitness" or "kid-centered movement classes."
Would including some facts about childhood obesity and youth sports injuries in the opening description be a tad (mis)leading?
Quote:
Originally Posted by stingo
This is probably nitpicking, but...
You have FAIR/NEUTRAL listed as a possible value - to my mind they don't mean the same thing. I'd suggest using Excellent, Very Good, Good, Fair, Poor or Excellent, Good, Neutral, Fair, Poor. In the same vein, DON'T KNOW/NEUTRAL are two different responses, and should be split out (and I would probably change NEUTRAL to NO OPINION).
Good call. I'll re-work the categories. I may just get rid of the neutral/no opinion option.
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http://wufoo.com/ might be a better option than google docs, donno. Otto just happened to mention it.
Maybe you'd want to break it into 2 surveys? it feels rather long, and like you could group the info into 2 different sets about services and demographics… I donno, but it feels like you're giving too many options, but maybe not. http://sivers.org/jam
Okay, I just dumped a bunch of questions, mostly from Section 4, and re-worded some questions and choices. Take two.
As for splitting it up, I tried making two separate surveys, but the questions kept overlapping, so I gave up on that approach. What I wouldn't pay (if I had the money) for some marketing research operation to just come do all this stuff for me
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And now a third iteration. Condensed some questions into still fewer total, bringing it down to twenty-five questions as the most anyone would answer (not counting demographic and contact info), made wording more consistent across the board, added two definitions to the introduction, and re-added an "undecided" option to pertinent items.
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I've actually managed to read all three versions of the survey before actually getting around to replying.
I like the last one best. The only thing is in section 4 I wouldn't answer the questions about how I feel about Soundsmith Fitness before actually trying your classes. Since it's a required question that would probably kick the whole survey out. I would either eliminate those questions, make them optional or add a undecided option for answering.
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