Okay so now I am confused.... What EXACTLY is your end game here? You are worried about running an Army PT run (I think that is a 2 mile run) Yup, it's 2 miles and cannot max situps and pushups I did max my pushups! yet you have a 4 day lifting program that you are hell bent to do WHILE on a deficit.
I might be all washed up but I would prioritize some things. Looking at the AVI it seems to me that you are probably not in danger of obesity issues. So the defecit thing can probably be put on hold until you pass the PT test which (IMHO) should probably be your main focus over the next weeks. I would drop most of the gym lifting routine stuff and do the running/pushup/situp training program that you have in your hands while eating at maintenance to support the goal of passing the test. Not concerned with obesity, true (that pic was at my lowest weight, the night before my comp, dont' look like that now), however, wouldn't lifting HELP my pt test in some way?
I guess I am trying to perhaps say that you are trying to do too much and you will likely not do well if you don't prioritize and give your body the right amount of rest for the goals you are trying to do... You can do it all... just not all at the same time.
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Originally Posted by Lost Dog
Edit -- Karla got there first. Spot on. ^^
You only have 3 weeks to improve your running, so just work on that and do maint lifting until the PT test is over. Nothing bad will happen in 3 weeks if you lift AT ALL. Come up with the perfect plan later. Right now your perfect plan should be not to fail the PT test. That's it.
Pushups I maxed, situps, I did better than last year, so my goal is to better next time, it's the running where I totally suck. How would maintenance lifting be different than what I outlined above? Do you mean lifting at maintenance calories?
Ok, haha, sorry to confuse you guys - I'm trying to multi-task: prepping to re-take the PT test (which is really not that big of a deal, the running is only where I"m concerned with major improvement), and fat loss. Heck, I lost almost 4% bf when I was at basic training, and I took several PT tests and "lifted" while I was there Haha, then again, I most certainly was NOT on a deficit.
Point being, I don't think it's going to hurt my running,pushups or situps to have fat loss still be my primary goal - I just want to include them in my simplified training so I'm doing two things at once.
Karla, I AM a soldier, but I'm National Guard, so I only have to do this test once a year, so it's not my main thing all the time - hence my lack of proficiency in those three events....doesn't help that I HATE running.
I'm at 11xbw right now (my former bw of 128, so that puts me about 1400), and right now I'm weighing around 126. Since I'm losing weight, but dont' want to hurt myself in any way, would fat loss still be achievable with less of a deficit? I just know that you don't burn a ton of calories through exercise, though I'm going to be running more often for the next 3 weeks for sure.
I don't see anything wrong with strength training while on a deficit. I would consider saving as much muscle and strength as possible while losing fat to be of utmost importance.
Me either. But the WS4SB's template that I was using was like 7 sessions over 5 days and included sprints on top of heavy lifts. Perhaps it was a different template that what you're referring to. It was not wise to attempt while on a deficit.
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Originally Posted by fluteangel
Heck, I lost almost 4% bf when I was at basic training, and I took several PT tests and "lifted" while I was there Haha, then again, I most certainly was NOT on a deficit.
Whoa! You were able to lift while at basic training? And you weren't in a deficit? Hell, I ate three desserts at every meal (when we got to sit down and actually eat) and still lost weight. I barely got time to write one letter a week.
Whoa! You were able to lift while at basic training? And you weren't in a deficit? Hell, I ate three desserts at every meal (when we got to sit down and actually eat) and still lost weight. I barely got time to write one letter a week.
HA... yeah... sounds like a new kind of Army.
Yes, I meant for you to eat at maintenance until the test is over THEN switch to more fat loss mode. Since you are very close to an ideal scale weight for your height you might consider a very, very tiny deficit with your lifting program after you pass the PT test. If you keep the deficit really tiny and lift really, really heavy you may end up achieving some really nice recomp goals. Do you have another comp coming up soon?
And yes, the lifting may help you with general fitness. (depends on how you are lifting) but IMHO it doesn't replace it. In my own case, I have been training for bbing and doing nothing but strength and hypertrophy lifting for nearly a year. That training alone allowed me to qualify at a tryout for a semi-pro full contact football team. So it left me with decent enough conditioning.
BUT I cannot continue this training while I am trying to further condition and be part of the football team. I must now switch my overall training to match my end goal since my new end is to be a football player as opposed to getting as much muscle as I can... Instead of lifting huge volume to failure in the gyms 4 times a week, I now do pushups, sprinting, situps and all the things the team does to be conditioned for a game.
My lifting days have been cut to 2 and the volume has been drastically cut. Once I get my mojo down for football playing, I will again start to increase my lifting time in the gym and see if I can do a strength program. Like I said... I think you can do multiple things but you have to prioritize the things that you do and train for that priority and give the body time to adapt and to rest...
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The BIGGER I get the smaller you look
Me either. But the WS4SB's template that I was using was like 7 sessions over 5 days and included sprints on top of heavy lifts. Perhaps it was a different template that what you're referring to. It was not wise to attempt while on a deficit.
I guess I just don't get it. Perhaps it's an old school thing. To me the whole point of training for fat loss is to "work it off" not bring down the work load to eliminate the effect of being on a caloric deficit in the first place. Besides the OP doesn't look like that deficit would be needed for a long period of time. We're not talking about a large deficit here are we? That's never a good idea.
Anyways, I prefer to play the calories up or down ( +/- 2-300 cals), not the workload. Otherwise you "throw out the baby with the bath water" as the saying goes.
The original WS4SB template with 2 days off and 1max lower, 1 max upper and 1 repetition upper. The OP would use the conditioning days for running practice. The a.m./p.m. thing on Monday would be optional. It's sort of like, perhaps, maybe similar to PowerMans suggested set up.
*
MONDAY (A.M.) - MAX-EFFORT Upper Body lift
*
MONDAY (P.M.) - Sprint work, conditioning, GPP or skill training (this is purposely broad and varied to cover different sports/disciplines. For me conditioning and skill training is required to maintain my martial arts techniques. I also sprint in case I ever need to run like hell )
*
TUESDAY - OFF or Restoration techniques
*
WEDNESDAY - Sprint work, conditioning, GPP or skill training
*
THURSDAY - REPETITION Upper Body lift
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FRIDAY - Sprint work, conditioning, GPP or skill training
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SATURDAY - Lower Body lift
*
SUNDAY - OFF or Restoration techniques
The subsequent versions were changed because people wanted another lower day for dynamic work.
You know... I just saw your thread in the Fat Loss forum and for the life of me I cannot figure out why you want to lose scale weight as a priority. It seems to be your only focus. This especially if you are looking to do a competition again. Did you not get hit with the "needs more muscle" comment by at least one judge at your last comp? You came in at 113 lbs and 5'3" or something simmilar which is pretty small IMHO (assuming figure bf%).
When you get close to your ideal scale weight then the focus really needs to be on keeping scale weight while losing fat as much as possible if you want to improve overall muscle gains. Otherwise you risk losing muscle as you drop scale weight. Sure you lose bf% too but what's the point of that if you are competing?
While I am not suggesting you do the same 100%, I get mad as hell if I lose so much as a lb on the scale (within my water flux range of course). Yet I manage to get smaller in the waist and bf% keeps going down on my current macros... Big bonus is that the diet is pretty easy since it is so close to maintenance and I can lift really heavy still (with a reasonable volume of course). Just another perspective from another person in a similar boat.
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The BIGGER I get the smaller you look
Whoa! You were able to lift while at basic training? And you weren't in a deficit? Hell, I ate three desserts at every meal (when we got to sit down and actually eat) and still lost weight. I barely got time to write one letter a week.
haha, no. By lifting I meant carrying rucksacks, full battle-rattle gear, heavy stuff like water cans and sandbags and doing TONS of pushups and various other PT torture. I didn't see a real gym tilla fterwards. You ate dessert??!?! No way did I ever touch the fat cake, I didn't want the drills to see me. But no, I didn't lose any weight at basic, I gained 6 lbs, but my bf went down
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Originally Posted by kfisherx
You know... I just saw your thread in the Fat Loss forum and for the life of me I cannot figure out why you want to lose scale weight as a priority. It seems to be your only focus. This especially if you are looking to do a competition again. Did you not get hit with the "needs more muscle" comment by at least one judge at your last comp? You came in at 113 lbs and 5'3" or something simmilar which is pretty small IMHO (assuming figure bf%).
When you get close to your ideal scale weight then the focus really needs to be on keeping scale weight while losing fat as much as possible if you want to improve overall muscle gains. Otherwise you risk losing muscle as you drop scale weight. Sure you lose bf% too but what's the point of that if you are competing?
While I am not suggesting you do the same 100%, I get mad as hell if I lose so much as a lb on the scale (within my water flux range of course). Yet I manage to get smaller in the waist and bf% keeps going down on my current macros... Big bonus is that the diet is pretty easy since it is so close to maintenance and I can lift really heavy still (with a reasonable volume of course). Just another perspective from another person in a similar boat.
I really am not so focused on scale weight, but it sounds like it because I throw the wrong words around - sorry! I really want to drop the bodyfat. I put on a good amount of muscle last year and I'm still trying to drop the fat to see it! I just figure that I've got such a good amount to lose that my weight should go down, too. I know bf hasn't dropped much because my measurements haven't changed in a good long while. But yeah, I'm all over lifting heavy, eating a lot and maintaining my muscle while dropping bf, or rather, getting to that glorious stage known as maintenance.
Oh, and yes I did get the needs more muscle comment, but mostly I got the comment to "lean out more". Which was true.
I don't have a comp coming up any time soon, I just want to drop the fat and be done with it soon, so I can maintain for awhile, do maybe a specialization and then drop again for a comp maybe next year. Maybe not.
After thinking about it all, I'm going to do the K.I.S.S. 4-day program I had put out before, it's got me lifting heavy with really low volume and that way, I'm in and out of the gym quickly (I'd rather do half-body training, than whole body right now, and split up my training). I'm going to fore-go the structured PT improvement plan I laid out before; I think it's far too intense and too much volume for me with where I am right now.
So I'll get in pushups just about every day (a few here and a few there, when I think about it), with structured improvement drills maybe 3x's a week, same with abs. My focus is more on improving my running anyway. I figure if I get in a little bit of running every day, and then intersperse that with a couple days of running intervals and 2 days of longer runs, with 1-2 days of cross training, like cycling (all for no more than 30 minutes)
That's how I got better at basic - do what you suck at, which was all three. But by the end, I didn't suck at anything.
And if I start to feel run-down AT ALL, the calories are going to go up to 12xbw. I want fat loss, but not at the expense of injury to myself.
yet you have a 4 day lifting program that you are hell bent to do WHILE on a deficit. 
Haha, then again, I most certainly was NOT on a deficit.
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