on the maxOT website it says to start out basically straight vertical and as you pull the handle bars down, lean back into a 45 degree angle and pull the bar to your upper chest.
Would it not be better to stay leaned back the whole time so you don't end up working your lower back by leaning?
Also, if I go as wide as possible on the grip handles, will that ensure most lat usage? Because again he says to go right up the point the handles begin to angle down but going wide makes it harder and thus makes me think it uses the lats more instead of tri's.
I start almost 90 and usually end my pull at 60 degrees. If you move too much, you can cheat by getting momentum out of the angle change. Also, by starting upright, you really get a nice stretch each rep.
I also find if I go too wide, the weight drops a great deal and it is hard to get the bar to your chest. I hold my wide lat bar right where the bar angles downward. I also notice some wrist strain if I am too wide when I am in the starting position.
But would going wider target the lats more? I got a horrible freaking hourglass shape that I MUST lose and I need my lats targeted as much as it's possibly safe.
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It's hard for me to say as I try to do weighted pull ups vs. lat pulldowns for lat and back development.
My understanding is if you go narrow, it works the lower Lat harder, and wide works the upper portion harder. Wide also would eliminate more of the tri and Bi (depending on grip) and focus the Lat more. Have you though of doing pullups instead?
One thing you should be doing to hit the lats more is scapular retraction on every rep. At the beginning of the rep, squeeze your shoulder blades together and keep them that way. Think about pushing your chest out to meet the bar, or making sure your elbows are behind your toros when fully contracted. In that way, you minimize the effect of the middle back mucles and force the lats to work harder. It's also just plain good form.
According to Ian King, wide grip emphasizes the lats more since the arms can't play as much of a role, whereas with a neutral grip, you hit the back and arms more. A reverse (or chinup) grip, hits your arms and lower lats more.
Oooh good info, thanks. Yeah I should try doing pullups since I think I'm actually strong enough know to be able to pull out 3 sets in the 4-6 rep range, however I am looking for maximal size gain and it was my understanding that the pullup will build more strength but not as much size.
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I don't lean at all, stay vertical through the entire movement, try and keep the shoulders squeezed though.
I will try the lean thing next pull-down day at the gym.
Og.
__________________ 2009: No races, No times. Slow year. So, now you're 96 cals short. You're now in starvation mode. Doomed. - LostDog
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Og, vertical versus leaning is also a function of shoulder flexibility. If you have good flexbility, you're able to maintain vertical much more. Nothing wrong with that, just that many people don't have that kind of rotational ability. If you are concerned about isolating the lats, what you are doing is actually more effective, I believe.
Yeah I too stayed vertical and thought leaning was bad form. I'm a noob
Although I've noticed towards the end of the pull I kinda have to shift my weight "above" the bar to push it down which I'm sure is even worse form so, off to leaning I go
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I typically deal with form based on the muscle I am trying to work... Ie if I am trying to work my back on the pulldown I try and minimize my bodies movement in other planes to minimize it's momentum. If I was doing curls, I wouldn't rock back and forth either. When I do seated rows I don't push off with my legs, that sort of thing.
We have one guy in the gym I go to who pulls the weight down to his chest, leans back, lets the weights go all the way back to the stack, his ass comes literally a foot and a half of the seat and then he uses his body weight to start the next rep as he sits back down. One day i'll catch him in a mirror and drop a frickin' dumbbell on myself, because I am laughing so hard.
as for my shoulder, I can get it vertical, but I feel it may put undue strain on my shoulder, I'll try some of the lean next time.
Og.
Og.
__________________ 2009: No races, No times. Slow year. So, now you're 96 cals short. You're now in starvation mode. Doomed. - LostDog
Blog entry: November 1, 2009, Pancakes LiveSTRONG daily plate log
Originally posted by Ogedei:
We have one guy in the gym I go to who pulls the weight down to his chest, leans back, lets the weights go all the way back to the stack, his ass comes literally a foot and a half of the seat and then he uses his body weight to start the next rep as he sits back down. One day i'll catch him in a mirror and drop a frickin' dumbbell on myself, because I am laughing so hard.
hahaha
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