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Old 04-16-2009, 02:29 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Question Doug's Deadlifts. Critique request!!



Note that I'm 6'3", and so my starting position is going to be different than somebody with shorter legs:



I keep looking into the mirror as I'm still getting the "feel" of where I want my butt..

Light weights cause I want to get my form down before I go up in weight..

Thanks!
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Old 04-16-2009, 03:27 PM   #2 (permalink)
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I'm sorry, but I'm more interested in the guy working out on the elliptical in jeans and a fleece in the background.. I mean, WTF?!

Also, it looks like your shoulders are too far forward. They should be behind the bar. I think your butt should also be a little farther back and down. Otherwise, I think it looks good, but I'm no expert.
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Old 04-16-2009, 03:38 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Yeah, he's..... special...


Quote:
They should be behind the bar.
No offense.. This sounds wrong..
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Old 04-16-2009, 04:21 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dougz View Post
No offense.. This sounds wrong..
It is wrong. I spent years behind a bar and all it got me was a huge tab and a massive han......

Wait, are we talking about the same bar?
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Old 04-16-2009, 05:41 PM   #5 (permalink)
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- Take your shoes off, or get flatter shoes
- and you seem to be coming forward on to your toes, dont

and your shoulders should be in front of the bar just like the pictures you have there from starting strength
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Old 04-16-2009, 05:42 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Man, I hate Hex plates. They're especially annoying with deadlifts. And what the heck is with that music!

If you really want to improve your deadlifts, read the 3 part series by Cressey on t-nation--it'll help a lot. On some of those reps, it looks like your leaning too far back on lockout.

As for the above posts, the scapula should be over the bar (according to Rippetoe).
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Old 04-16-2009, 05:44 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Doug,

Shoulders forward of the bar, scapula over the bar, starting position will be a bit different for everyone but i would just suggest slowing down, being more deliberate in your setup, and review your form with your camera after your set rather than looking sideways in the mirrors to check form.

Follow the Rippetoe setup:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Syt7A23YnpA

My two cents, slow down, more weight on the bar, really focus on getting your back into the best natural arch, chest up, head neutral, and squeeze the weight up close to your shins.

Good luck, i think you'll have a pretty big deadlift once you get your setup tight.
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Old 04-17-2009, 04:52 AM   #8 (permalink)
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The only thing I will comment on (because it actually hurt my back watching it-no offense intended) is that you are replacing hip extension with lumbar extension. You really need to work on firing those glutes more.


Xband walks, glute bridging and single leg training is your friend. Also do some hip mobility work. I would also suggest putting the bar on a block. I don't like your starting position (you did say you were really tall. But, you already seem to have that little c curve in the back which I hate to see)


Oh and I almost forgot. Retract those shoulder blades. Lots of rowing and thoracic mobility for you as well(weak scapular retractors and or poor thoracic mobility could be another reason you get the c look).
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Old 04-17-2009, 09:34 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Ok, thanks guys..

I'll track down those Cressey links, etc.

Regarding the shoulder blades, if I retract them any more, I can't reach the bar.. UNLESS I bend my lnees more, which would have me squatting the weight up, which was my mistake before..

Hmmm...
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Old 04-17-2009, 09:36 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Der, I was totally before thinking that was just a pic and was wondering why you were asking for form input from a pic and not vid.

I'm wondering if lowering your ass a bit to start will help, so that you're not finishing off with an RDL movement.

Its like you're doing the movement in 2 steps rather than one. First you're extending your legs, then your back. Rather than just coming up and having glutes work with your quads to extend yourself all together… if that makes any sense. Is why I wonder if slightly tweaking your starting position will help that (in addition to all that other great input you've already gotten).
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Old 04-17-2009, 09:47 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aoife View Post
Der, I was totally before thinking that was just a pic and was wondering why you were asking for form input from a pic and not vid.
Me too! It wasn't until I read the comments about there being music, etc that I realized it was a vid! But, I have nothing constructive to add. I'm still ironing out my own form. Wish my video camera wasn't broken!
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Old 04-17-2009, 09:50 AM   #12 (permalink)
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WHAT! You can click on things on the webz!

Seriously. I had the same thoughts as Aoife had on the deadlift form. It looks like it is being done in two distinct steps.

I was concerned about him lifting the last part of it completely with his back.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aoife View Post
Der, I was totally before thinking that was just a pic and was wondering why you were asking for form input from a pic and not vid.

I'm wondering if lowering your ass a bit to start will help, so that you're not finishing off with an RDL movement.

Its like you're doing the movement in 2 steps rather than one. First you're extending your legs, then your back. Rather than just coming up and having glutes work with your quads to extend yourself all together… if that makes any sense. Is why I wonder if slightly tweaking your starting position will help that (in addition to all that other great input you've already gotten).
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Old 04-17-2009, 08:47 PM   #13 (permalink)
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In english:

1) You are straightening your legs too soon.

2) The bar is out too far from your body.

3) Skip the side mirrors looks.
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Old 04-17-2009, 08:50 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dougz View Post
Ok, thanks guys..

I'll track down those Cressey links, etc.

Regarding the shoulder blades, if I retract them any more, I can't reach the bar.. UNLESS I bend my lnees more, which would have me squatting the weight up, which was my mistake before..

Hmmm...


I looked at it again. And actually the shoulder blades don't look all that bad.


But, the first part of my post really did concern me. Power from the spine is one of the greatest predictors of injury. Spread the floor, pretend like someone is pressing directly down on your sacrum and drive with dem hips.
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Old 04-17-2009, 08:53 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by erikido23 View Post
...pretend like someone is pressing directly down on your sacrum and drive with dem hips.
What the hell is a sacrum?
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Old 04-17-2009, 09:03 PM   #16 (permalink)
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tailbone
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Old 04-17-2009, 10:15 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Oh, and one more thing, put some weight on the bar. I think part of your form problem is due to the fact the weight is so light. If you watch the video you are almost tossing the bar forward on your descent.
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Old 04-17-2009, 10:31 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Oh and I almost forgot. Retract those shoulder blades.
But not at the start of the lift, nobody is strong even a moderately heavy deadlift with their shoulders retracted.
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Old 04-18-2009, 12:51 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Quote:
First you're extending your legs, then your back
True..

I'll see what I can do about this..

Quote:
I think part of your form problem is due to the fact the weight is so light
Yeah, I just didn't want to have bad form with heavier weights and maybe hurt myself..

I'll start loading it up now that I'm getting closer, at least..

Thanks..

Quote:
3) Skip the side mirrors looks.
This will diminish as I get a feel for keeping my butt up.. Like I say, I was geting in the habit of almost squatting it up...
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Old 04-18-2009, 06:16 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank.S View Post
But not at the start of the lift, nobody is strong even a moderately heavy deadlift with their shoulders retracted.

That is a good point and one that i missed for a long time.
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Old 04-23-2009, 10:20 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Ive seen MUCH worse, but there are quite a few issues that you have. My advice is to check out the deadlifting articles on t-nation.com they have a bunch of them will all the common issues.

Also, i'd recommend starting with rack pulls at below the knee and going a bit heavier.


But if I had to pick the things that really stood out to me it would be:

1) too much lumbar extension instead of hip extension
2) Do not shrug or pull the bar up.

99% of the movement in a deadlift should be below the waist. The hands are like hooks, the traps, shoulders, and upper back should ancor the shoulders into a neutral or slightly retracted position, the entire torso becomes rigid, but there shouldn't be much extesion above the waist. So all of that above the waist is really supporting isometric strength. All the movement comes from straightening the legs and extending the hips (knee extension, hip extension). Hope this helps.
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Old 04-23-2009, 10:23 PM   #22 (permalink)
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One more thing that might help.


Like someone above said, spread the floor, but also dont think of lifting the weight off the ground. Instead think of pushing the floor away through your heels.
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Old 04-24-2009, 01:02 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Ok, I'll see what I can do..
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