A funky split to target hams & lats

[Espi]

About a week ago, my SO made a few pics of me and once again I got confronted with the fact that my back side doesn't look too great.
Yes, I am quite strong in deadlifts and can row up a storm, but my lats are staying pitifully small and so do my hamstrings since the deadlifts are mainly a back exercise for me.

Hence, why I dreamed up a new routine that will make me put more
emphasis on lats, shoulders and hamstrings. It's going to be 3 different routines for an every other day lifting regime.
1 for the back of the body
2+3 a BW routine

Considering the fact that training the lats & hams will automatically mean that those will not be as strong for the next day, I'm avoiding this by making it into 6 slightly different workout routines

1 back heavy & hams moderate
2 LB heavy & UB moderate
3 UB heavy & LB moderate
4 hams heavy & back moderate
5 UB heavy & LB moderate
6 LB heavy & UB moderate

WO 1+4 will be done in a different gym, which is outfitted with quite a bit of funky (old) equipment that my current gym doesn't have.

WO 1
back heavy :
* T-bar row or std cable rows
hams modereate
* a kind of GHR station
* lying leg curl

WO 4 :
back moderate
* lat pull downs (NO chins or supine rows are possible here )
hams heavy :
* plate-loaded (2-feet) leg press
* good morning

In the other gym this can be done
WO 2+6 :
LB heavy: DL + hang cleans + front squat + single-leg press
UB moderate : decline db presses/db rows/supine rows

WO 3+5
UB heavy : db presses (sorry no bb press), military presses + chins & bb rows
LB moderate: RDL + leg press +seated leg curls

I've not yet decided which assistance exercises I will do, eg. whether or not I want to also train bis/tris/calves/etc. Probably it will depend on how much energy/time I've got left. I'm already seeing though that it is probably wiser to not do FB but instead do an UB/LB split for WO 2/3 5/6 .

Reps/sets: probably something similar to current routine = waves for 1-2 exercises and in the 6-12 hh range for the assistance exercises.

I especially am excited about a genius-like split that allows me to hit the upper back & hams 3x/wk and the chest & quads twice a week.

Fire away please!

[Espi]

BUMP. First cycle failed miserably because of overloaded hamstrings that gave me wicked DOMS which made doing full body workouts a misery, especially when trying to eat at a deficit.
For the first time in I don't know how many years I took 1 week off without being ill or away, only because I felt overworked in the gym.

Not giving up so easily I've revamped things for a bit and go for a UB/LB workout when I am in my regular gym.


Decided on:

Day 1A (back dominant, ham accessory) in my 'new' gym with tons of old iron & isolation machines
A BW mixed grip chins 3 sets

B1 : T-bar row : single wave + drop set in cut / double wave in bulk
B2: 1-leg press : 3 sets

C1 wide std cable row : 3 sets
C2: lying leg curl : 2-3 sets

D1 : lat pull down 2 sets
D2 GM machine 2 sets

E1 - F1 (and perhaps G1): Exercises you've never tried before targeting back - biceps or hams) 1 or 2 sets of each or just trying one of the funky isolation machines in this gym


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Day 2 (after back dominant or after UB if ham dominant)
LB - workout in my regular gym

A hang clean : hang cleaning 4 fixed wt barbells 25-28-30-35 out of the way and if energetic enough , hang cleaning them back after the front squats too.

B1 front squat : single wave + drop set in cut / double wave in bulk
B2 sumo DL w vertical shins : single wave + drop set in cut / double wave in bulk ---> sofar : DOMS from hell

C1 1-legged leg press: 2-3 sets
C2 Smith lunge: 2-3 sets

D1 pull through : 2 sets
D2 seated leg curl: 2 sets

E1 wood chop or Saxon side bend: 1 set
F1 kneeling cable crunch : 1 set
G1 cable exo rotation: 1 set



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Day 3 (after ham dominant or after LB if back dominant)
UB - workout in my regular gym

A weighted chins : approx 5 sets w lots of rest time

B1 db press : single wave + drop set in cut / double wave in bulk
B2 bb bent over row : single wave + drop set in cut / double wave in bulk

C1 military press: 2-3 sets
C2 1-arm LPD (1 pulley tied to 2 hooks, pulling both cables): 2-3 sets

D1 triceps push down (OR maybe EZ-bar skull crusher?): 2 sets
D2 pec deck: 2 sets

E1+2+3 : goblet squat+renegade row+db swing when feeling energetic

F1+G1 (or E1+F1): Exercises you've never tried before targeting chest - triceps - abs or shoulders 1 or 2 sets of each



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and finally

Day 1B (ham dominant, back accessory) in my 'new' gym with tons of old iron & isolation machines

A1 plate loaded leg press : single wave + drop set in cut / double wave in bulk
A2 GM: single wave + drop set in cut / double wave in bulk ---> sofar : DOMS from hell

B1 1-leg press : 3 sets
B2 V-bar lat pull down : 3 sets

C1 hammer curl 2 sets
C2 ?


D1 +E1 (+F1 ): Exercises you've never tried before targeting hams , back or biceps 1 or 2 sets of each or just trying one of the funky isolation machines in this gym

[Fulmen]

For lat width just stick with BB Rows, lat pulldowns and pullups.

Hams-stiff-legged DL's, leg curls

Can't go wrong with the basics. And keep it heavy.

[Espi]

I've been suggested to do sumo DL for hams. Not something I'd thought of before or had even done.
It's a bit, err extremely awkward to do if formerly 90% of strength came out of the back. Esp. my glutes are dying

The suggestion was made by someone with a PL-interest. Powerlifters often do sumo-style.
One of my BB-oriented friends said SLDL just like you. Weight is not as important as ROM & TUT he explained.

I'll try the SLDL next time and will compare.

BTW, I've done SLDL before, but it's been eons ago. Always did them on a step bench (at a deficit) though as I don't even feel something in my hams when I'd try this from the floor.

[Fulmen]

Originally Posted by Espi

I've been suggested to do sumo DL for hams. Not something I'd thought of before or had even done.
It's a bit, err extremely awkward to do if formerly 90% of strength came out of the back. Esp. my glutes are dying

The suggestion was made by someone with a PL-interest. Powerlifters often do sumo-style.
One of my BB-oriented friends said SLDL just like you. Weight is not as important as ROM & TUT he explained.

I'll try the SLDL next time and will compare.

BTW, I've done SLDL before, but it's been eons ago. Always did them on a step bench (at a deficit) though as I don't even feel something in my hams when I'd try this from the floor.

Did you use enough weight?

[Espi]

For the SLDL?

About a year ago I did them 3 times, and used 45 up to 50 kg for 20 reps.
For sumo-DL I did 75x6-80x5-85x4-55x12 reps.
Conventional DLs are mostly a back affair: 110kg is my 1RM max but I did a 77,5x18 rep 'drop'set once. A normal amt of reps would have been around 8-10. One of the reasons I love wave loading

But I'm getting off topic. For SLDLs I think I should be doing 8-15 reps, and not the wave loading as I did for sumo DLs. Or can I do them with equally low reps?

[stingo]

Not that I know anything about anything but... what about glute-ham raises?

[Espi]

A glute-ham raise as in having someone sit on your feet = excruciatingly hard.
I thought there was a GHR-'thingy' in my new gym, but apparently not. More like a 'butt blaster', that's not even as good as the hip station in my own gym.

[Fulmen]

Originally Posted by Espi

For the SLDL?

About a year ago I did them 3 times, and used 45 up to 50 kg for 20 reps.
For sumo-DL I did 75x6-80x5-85x4-55x12 reps.
Conventional DLs are mostly a back affair: 110kg is my 1RM max but I did a 77,5x18 rep 'drop'set once. A normal amt of reps would have been around 8-10. One of the reasons I love wave loading

But I'm getting off topic. For SLDLs I think I should be doing 8-15 reps, and not the wave loading as I did for sumo DLs. Or can I do them with equally low reps?

I wouldn't be able to feel it either if I was using such light weight (i.e. 20 reps). Up the weight a lot and stick to 6-8 for 4 sets. Tell me how it goes.

[StuWard]

Originally Posted by Fulmen

I wouldn't be able to feel it either if I was using such light weight (i.e. 20 reps). Up the weight a lot and stick to 6-8 for 4 sets. Tell me how it goes.

I concur on upping the weight. You should be in the same magnitude as your squat and deadlift. I like doing about 8 reps. Usually my grip starts to go first.

[StuWard]

Make sure it's the stiff-legged (slight bend at the knee) straight backed variation. You don't want to use a heavy weight on the rounded back variation or the straight legged variation.

[Espi]

We aren't talking Romanian deadlifts, are we? But then again, doing this off a platform will involve the hams in either way, so it doesn't really matter.

[StuWard]

The version I'm talking about is essentially the same as a Romanian Deadlift. You don't need a platform as you can't go that low while keeping your back straight.

[Espi]

Yes, I can. At least when we are talking about a flat (horizontal) back.
Not so much with an arched (vertical) back.

[Fulmen]

I also forgot to mention on lat pulldowns, use EVERY type of grip. Also, along with Heavy BB Rows and Lat Pulldowns I would do Seated Rows-so long as you do them right. "Right" means leaning forward and getting a stretch in your lats. If you dont feel that stretch in your lats, then you're wasting your time.

In fact if I were you I would take a day to hone your mind-muscle connection and feel out your lats, figuring out which movements hit/stretch them the best. Then you'll never look back.

Also, if you can handle it, hit lats twice a week. I started doing that and got a lot of "wow you got wider" from people I haven't seen in a while.

[Frank.S]

At one point I was hitting my lats 4-5x per week (2 movements each session) with:
DB rows
pullups
pulldowns
BB rows
Seated rows
Machine Rows

I have the stretch marks all over my lats to prove it, during this, one of my stretch marks split open and was bleeding.. Needless to say, they grew. Ive found the back can take a ton of volume without complaining.

As for hams, get stronger in the deadlift and wide stance squat and your hams will grow.