Smith Machine or no Smith Machine? Holy War! - JP Fitness Forums

NFOMan · 02-21-2008, 10:04 AM

Hi, Guys:
I'm new to this forum -- been weight training for about a year with good results (ever increasing my goals and achieving them).

I've been using the Smith machine for my squats, but have read several discussions about limited range and not encouraging good form, etc. Now that I'm seriously including squats in my routine, I recently tried the regular squat technique just to get a flavor for the difficulty of the form. (It's trickier than I thought).

So, here's the question. If your trying to start with good form and build up strength over time, is it better to start from the regular squat technique or rely on the safety and control of the Smith machine?

Opinions welcome!

ninja · 02-21-2008, 10:13 AM

None.

(make this a poll to see how lopsided it is going to be)

Jean-Paul · 02-21-2008, 10:16 AM

Agreed. No smith. They do make good stations for things like pull-ups, recline pull-ups, push-ups for people with low upper body strength, tying bands to, etc. That's about it.

missjane · 02-21-2008, 10:17 AM

And they make a good place to hang your towel.

Ian Kay · 02-21-2008, 10:30 AM

It's far better to begin with a free-standing squat, unloaded, and work your way up.

When you squat properly on your own, the muscles in your ankles, legs, hips and core work in tandem to stabilize and move the "load" (perhaps just your own bodyweight).

When you use the Smith machine, various stablizers are allowed to shut down, because that "control" you talked about above is being handled by the machine instead of yoru body.

As far as "safety", it's only unsafe to squat on your own if (a) your form is horrendous or (b) the load is too heavy. The really awful thing is that the Smith allows for bad form and improper loads. If you were to squat with 100lbs more than you should on a Smith and squat all the way down with bad form - on your toes, for example - you could actually do it, and maybe not feel that bad, because the Smith will assist you and keep the weight centered. If you tried that with a free squat, you'd destroy yourself.

So you say to yourself, "Sounds like the Smith is better beacuse I won't be able to "destroy myself"." This is where you have to realize that proper form and asking more of your stabilizing musculature actually promotes greater strength and growth!

I have no doubt that you can move up in weight and see some growth from using a Smith. However, I'm sure if you had started with a free squat and progressed from there, your results would've been even better!

Another, less concrete concept: relying on your own body for all of the balance and power in a lift creates a greater "body awareness". You think about your muscles differently, and feel them differently. This will actually carry over to other lifts.. thus leading to even more gains!

jsm27 · 02-21-2008, 10:31 AM

I use mine for inverted rows, and hip mobility drills. My clients dont even get to use it for anything other the above.

Oh...almost forgot my 3 year old daughter like to hang upside down and practice her gymnastics on it.

GG300 · 02-21-2008, 11:13 AM

Inverted Rows and a nice place to stack weights that you aren't using.

Cynic · 02-21-2008, 11:19 AM

Mobility drills:

TESTOSTERONE NATION - 10 Uses for a Smith Machine

RacerBill · 02-21-2008, 11:30 AM

Ian - excellent info.

I seriously doubt anyone around here thinks Smith machines are worthwhile.

Lisa~ · 02-21-2008, 01:14 PM

This thread turned into a discussion about the Smith machine. You might learn something:

Quote of the Year (no, century) from Muscle and Fiction

Mahler · 02-21-2008, 03:48 PM

The Smith Machine is like spell check for weight lifting. It tends to miss a lot of things.

LoriAnne · 02-21-2008, 06:30 PM

Glad to see I'm among like-minded individuals. Smith Machines are not all at neccesary if you have good form and are using appropriate weights.

ninja · 02-21-2008, 06:37 PM

I am officially calling out uthscsa19

NFOMan · 02-21-2008, 10:34 PM

Well, guys, I guess the concensus of the group is to stay the shit away from Smiths! I'm converted!

Thanks for your advice. I'll keep you up to date on my progress with regular squats. (Yeah, I know, they are a pain, but what in this forum isn't?)

(I wanted to say what the f*** but my wife hit me upside the head)

Simon C · 02-22-2008, 04:07 AM

Squats aren't a pain.

They are a joy, and a pleasure to do each week, although not as lovely and enjoyable as deadlifts. They also happen to kick ass at building strength and size!

GG300 · 02-22-2008, 06:28 AM

Quote:

Yeah, I know, they are a pain,

Not to disagree but start doing Bulgarian Split Squats (add a shoulder press if you still like these) and Walking Lunges (with or without a rotation) and that might make you think differently about doing the standard squats.

Simon C · 02-22-2008, 06:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GG300

Not to disagree but start doing Bulgarian Split Squats (add a shoulder press if you still like these) and Walking Lunges (with or without a rotation) and that might make you think differently about doing the standard squats.

Well said!

Brian A. · 02-22-2008, 09:11 AM

The only use I've found for a Smith machine is if I have a knot in my shoulder blade or mid back. Just position it at the right hight, put a plate on to keep it still and then lean in. Other than that stay away from it.