JP Fitness Forums - Personal Training  
Google
 
Web forums.jpfitness.com

Go Back   JP Fitness Forums - Personal Training > Fitness > Training Discussion
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

Training Discussion Ask workout questions or share your knowledge.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-02-2007, 03:09 PM   #1 (permalink)
Fulmen
Eat, Sleep, Lift Big
 
Fulmen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 466
Default Fitness Fads and Their Results

I need some people to enlighten me on the things I'm going to talk about. One thread on here made me think about the fads found in the fitness industry. The most recent one that comes to mind is a quirky "Postural" fad. With that, the other fads I've noticed is rubber bands (a.k.a. stretch bands), kettlebells; medicine (or swiss or balance) balls, electrode stimulation, vibration training, or the "Fat Burning Zone" (the chart and shit that people use when doing steady state cardio involving your heart rate).

Now I'm not a fool and won't spend a whole post saying that these fads were/are stupid and the related. Rather, I would like to know something. If you have used one, more, or all of those-Kettlebells, Medicine or Balance Balls, Rubber Bands, Postural Training, Electrode Stimulation, Vibration, or "Fat Burning Zone", then I have some questions.
-------------------------------------------------------
If your goal was hypertrophy:
  • How many inches did you gain on specific body parts and in what amount of time did it take you to achieve it (e.g. Using a routine based on kettlebells and Swiss Balls, I gained a half inch on my biceps in five weeks)?
If your goal was fat loss:
  • What was your body fat percentage before and after, and how long did it take you to achieve the result?
  • How many inches on your waist did you lose, and in what amount of time did it take you to achieve it?
If your goal was speed, strength, and/or endurance:
  • Did the amount of weight you do can do for 1 rep increase and if so, how long did it take to achieve the result?
  • Did your muscular endurance increase and if so, how long did it take to achieve the result?
  • If trying to increase sprint speed, was your speed higher after using the aforementioned techniques, and if so, in what amount of time did you achieve the result?
  • If trying to increase endurance speed and/or length, did the aforementioned techniques increase it, and if so, how long did it take to achieve the result?
-------------------------------------------------------

I will be suprised if any of this gets answered, but it's a worth a shot. With kettlebells, I won't be suprised if someone actually does give out some positive results they recieved from using them. As for everything else...


..Time will tell.
__________________
The JP Fitness Bodybuilder
Fulmen is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2007, 03:17 PM   #2 (permalink)
Frank.S
Powerlifting
 
Frank.S's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 5,986
Default

By using bands, I increased my max squat. Who knows if it had anything to do with the bands, but the training while using them did brind my squat up significantly.

So many fads out there I agree, this recent posture thing is nuts, or my favorite, the whole 'Fast Carbs PWO' thing.
Frank.S is online now  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Old 06-02-2007, 03:20 PM   #3 (permalink)
Fulmen
Eat, Sleep, Lift Big
 
Fulmen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 466
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank.S
By using bands, I increased my max squat. Who knows if it had anything to do with the bands, but the training while using them did brind my squat up significantly.
That's another thing that keeps my skepticism. The majority don't know if it was thing or another, since training is a culmination of exercises. Then again, you could find out what causes what if you do the same exercises, find the results, and then add in bands, and see what any extra results you can get.

Thanks for replying.
__________________
The JP Fitness Bodybuilder
Fulmen is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2007, 03:52 PM   #4 (permalink)
bipennate
Fitness Expert
 
bipennate's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: New Brunswick, NJ
Posts: 719
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fulmen
The most recent one that comes to mind is a quirky "Postural" fad.
I'm not sre whatyou're referring to: are you talking about joint positioning/mobility and muscle balance as a focus of corrective exercise selection?
bipennate is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2007, 04:21 PM   #5 (permalink)
Leigh P.
Fat Loss Troubleshooter
 
Leigh P.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,056
Default

Quote:
If your goal was hypertrophy:

* How many inches did you gain on specific body parts and in what amount of time did it take you to achieve it (e.g. Using a routine based on kettlebells and Swiss Balls, I gained a half inch on my biceps in five weeks)?
Muscle gain and size isn't just relative to equipment, it is also relative to nutrition in use of that equipment. Give a guy a log and excess calories and he can grow.
Quote:
If your goal was fat loss:

* What was your body fat percentage before and after, and how long did it take you to achieve the result?
* How many inches on your waist did you lose, and in what amount of time did it take you to achieve it?
Same principal as above. Give a guy a log and take away calories and he will lose.

I am not going to keep going. I get what you are saying, why all the "fads".

If you can honestly say that improving postural movement isn't going to help you increase your squat, then I am not even going to waste my time.

The simple truth is that balance and mobility training incorporated with your goals (be it fat loss, muscle gain, etc) primarily leads to less injury and better performance and function. To me this spells that you will be in the game longer, in less pain and making improvements faster because you aren't setting down on your 2nd set of lunges because you knee hurts.

Do you need a kettlebell to grow inches? No, of course not.
Does kettlebell training invite the use of more stabilizers and increase the balance challenge of a workout? Yes.
If someone is used to doing bicep curls in a squat rack, then is kettlebell work going to whoop their tail more? Damn right.

You have to take into account all the variables.
Leigh P. is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2007, 04:55 PM   #6 (permalink)
Fulmen
Eat, Sleep, Lift Big
 
Fulmen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 466
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leigh P.
The simple truth is that balance and mobility training incorporated with your goals (be it fat loss, muscle gain, etc) primarily leads to less injury and better performance and function. To me this spells that you will be in the game longer, in less pain and making improvements faster because you aren't setting down on your 2nd set of lunges because you knee hurts.
Good points. However; I believe that balance is a derivative of specific maximal strength (e.g. once you reach a specific level of leg strength, you can do one-legged squats-an exercise that incorporates balance, yet that doesn't mean that a powerlifter could do one). What is your opinion?

Then again I try my best to not include the general public into the equation-something of which I should've stated. My apologies. Also, I want to make clear that there are those that need such corrective exercises (but once again that concerns mainly the general public), and I have nothing against that. I consider it a "fad" to those who don't need it.

It just annoys me to hear that kettlebells to bands to swiss balls are some type of miracle to your exercise regimen. I'm sure everyone can understand.



*I forgot to add that in my original post that all the questions should be answered with nutrition having been the control group, thus leaving any changed results stemming from the use of the supposed "fads".
__________________
The JP Fitness Bodybuilder
Fulmen is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2007, 05:19 PM   #7 (permalink)
bipennate
Fitness Expert
 
bipennate's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: New Brunswick, NJ
Posts: 719
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fulmen
I consider it a "fad" to those who don't need it.
I have yet to meet anyone, be it normal, athlete, or other that doesn't have an issue in posture, proprioception, or muscle activation. In fact, athletes sometimes are the worst perpetrators of this.

Besides Leigh's points, it's a simple matter of length-tension: poor arthrokinematics and delayed muscle firing will directly lead to weaknesses in the kinetic chain...I've fixed people's movement and seen strength increases jump almost immediately (within weeks).
bipennate is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2007, 05:36 PM   #8 (permalink)
Irishdazza
Senior Member
 
Irishdazza's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Jersey, Channel Islands
Posts: 2,514
Default

So when are you coming to Jersey to help me out? My back twinge came back suddenly when I thought I had it fixed...with no discernable cause! It's a spasm, relieved by stretching...so I know the cause is elsewhere but damned if I can find it!
__________________
Regret for the things we did can be tempered by time; it is regret for the things we did not do that is inconsolable. -- Sidney J. Harris
Irishdazza is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2007, 07:02 PM   #9 (permalink)
RobLL
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Rural, Western Washington
Posts: 2,840
Default

Rubber Bands: I bought a few because if I work out at home they take the place of seated cable pulls, shoulder exercises, needed for one of the MagMob. Great tool to have in the home, travel gym.
RobLL is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2007, 09:24 PM   #10 (permalink)
Jean-Paul
I think, therefore I post
 
Jean-Paul's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Little Rock, AR
Posts: 14,470
Default

I can sort of understand this gripe with regards to trainers who use gadgets they don't fully understand. I went through my "Paul Chek phase" (to steal a phrase from Bill Hartman) many years ago, and frankly deserved the crap I caught for it.

However, many of these things are simply tools. K-bells are really nothing more than a D-bell will a different shape. I liked Dos's comment at the summit about the RKB certifications... It's like being certified in Dumbbells. But that doesn't mean that K-bells are stupid. It's still a weight. It's the hype built up around it that appears to be turning you off.

Rubber bands are great if you know how to use them and why you're using them. There are some very practical applications to using them.

Stability balls reached the point of being ridiculous with all the ways people were using them, but that doesn't mean that they don't have a place in a routine. Balancing on one foot while juggling Russian K-bells is not one of them.

Once nautilus was all the rage. Machines have dominated bodybuilding routines for a long time. As you may have observed in this forum, most of us are pretty set on doing ground-based fitness programs, but that doesn't mean that all machines are bad. I have a client that I will ocassionally use leg extensions/curls on because he has drop foot, and it really helps add a dimension to his workouts.

Regarding vibration training, I think before you throw it out as a useless fad you need to look at the research.

Again, I think it sounds to me like your complaint is more based on the droves of trainers who use stuff they don't really understand.
__________________
Jean-Paul Francoeur
www.jpfitness.com

http://forums.jpfitness.com
"Twenty years from now, you will be more disappointed by the things you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbour. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."
-Mark Twain

Jean-Paul is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 06-02-2007, 10:23 PM   #11 (permalink)
Fulmen
Eat, Sleep, Lift Big
 
Fulmen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 466
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jean-Paul
However, many of these things are simply tools. K-bells are really nothing more than a D-bell will a different shape. I liked Dos's comment at the summit about the RKB certifications... It's like being certified in Dumbbells. But that doesn't mean that K-bells are stupid. It's still a weight. It's the hype built up around it that appears to be turning you off.
Great points, and it is the hype built around all them that annoys me; hell, even if they're hyping up machines it makes me shake my head. Its as if people want to replace hard work with empty miracles.

Quote:
Once nautilus was all the rage. Machines have dominated bodybuilding routines for a long time. As you may have observed in this forum, most of us are pretty set on doing ground-based fitness programs, but that doesn't mean that all machines are bad.
I completely agree, and I personally believe that machines have a specific place in my bodybuilding career (e.g. using leg extension to bring out more definition of an already well-built quadricep base).

Thanks for all the replies; now I get to look at things from a different perspective-and that's how ya learn.
__________________
The JP Fitness Bodybuilder
Fulmen is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2007, 06:29 AM   #12 (permalink)
John Izzo
...who?
 
John Izzo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Hartford, CT
Posts: 1,026
Default

Speaking of machine "fads"...here may be the next one....

http://www.abcoaster.com/
__________________
John Izzo, NASM-CPT, PES
Site: www.standAPARTfitness.com
Blog: "A Day in the Life of a Personal Trainer"

New Issue of Training Revolutions #5 - FREE DOWNLOAD
John Izzo is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2007, 06:37 AM   #13 (permalink)
kingkop182
Team Ninja
 
kingkop182's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: England
Posts: 1,622
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Izzo
Speaking of machine "fads"...here may be the next one....

http://www.abcoaster.com/
Price/Unit: $1495
__________________
*****************************
Walk on through the wind
Walk on on through the rain
Tho' your dreams be tossed and blown
Walk on
Walk on
With hope in your heart
And You'll Never Walk Alone
kingkop182 is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2007, 06:46 AM   #14 (permalink)
cdkrug
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 493
Default

I'm using bands to bridge the gap between, "I can Lat Pulldown our entire weight pile for reps" and "I can do 10 pullups."

It's the most portable tool I can use to get me across that progressive resistance gap, until such time as the detachable leg is invented.
cdkrug is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2007, 09:33 AM   #15 (permalink)
richarddoughtyfitness
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 37
Default

just wanted to post my feelings on the postural fad thing

for anyone short of competive bodybuilders posture should be one of the main concerns when lifting, for the average person does it really matter if they can bench an extra ten lbs or gain a fraction of an inch on their chest if they did it at the cost of causing their humurus to rotate internally and adventally causeing a rotator cuff tear due to scupla disfunction all due to not consdiering functional musclar balance
this is most likely a bad example but i just wanted to prove a point

i think we see alot of people in therapy for suff they could of avoided by doing some mobility work pre work out and programming better
richarddoughtyfitness is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2007, 12:14 PM   #16 (permalink)
Luke Denley
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 129
Default

I have used bands, I have used chains, I currently use kettlebells, I use rocks, a tire, a wheelbarrow that I load up, a sledgehammer, and traditional barbells and dumbells. I use everything that I think will help me in my training. I don;t exclusively use one thing or another, and I don;t think that one thing is the be all, end all of training. Limiting yourself to only one type of implement if others are avilable to you is a self defeating action in my opinion.
Luke Denley is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2007, 02:19 PM   #17 (permalink)
Steve-O-68
Who dat? Who dere?
 
Steve-O-68's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Kansas City, MO
Posts: 1,749
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Luke Denley
I have used bands, I have used chains, I currently use kettlebells, I use rocks, a tire, a wheelbarrow that I load up, a sledgehammer, and traditional barbells and dumbells. I use everything that I think will help me in my training. I don;t exclusively use one thing or another, and I don;t think that one thing is the be all, end all of training. Limiting yourself to only one type of implement if others are avilable to you is a self defeating action in my opinion.
Agreed. Just because something is a fad or the hot thing at the moment, doesn't mean it's not effective. The obvious exception here crappy, high dollar machines that stick you in a fixed plane of motion.
__________________
Those who live by the sword, get shot by those who don't.

Stephen Antel, NESTA-PFT
Steve-O-68 is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in Technorati