Couple of weeks left in some conferences and already the controversy is brewing. Here's what I am hearing here on Chicago sportsradio:
-OSU: If they fall from #1 for some unknown reason, people who do the polls should be sterlized to prevent passing their stupid genes to future idiots.
-Michigan: Either they or USC (if they win out) should get a crack at OSU in the championship game, but the system is really skewed against them. Looking at losses, they have the 'best' loss to the #1 team by 3 points. Beat 2 other top 10 teams and barely lost to the #1.
-USC: has a legitimate chance if they trounce ND and win out. Their wins have been, arguably, better than Michigan (marginally in my mind), but their loss was much worse, a greater lapse.
-Notre Dame: if they win out and vault to #2 above Michigan, who trounced them, then you know the Notre Dame $$$$s have come in to play. That would be shameful and I would be among those calling for the entire system to be scrapped. (sorry Kevin T.)
Florida: of all the teams, they have a legitimate gripe with the controversial loss to Auburn, but they lost by more than one score as well.
If USC kicks the crap out of ND, then they have a legit claim to #2 (assuming they beat UCLA as well). If USC doesn't trounce ND, then Michigan has a very strong case for #2. At the moment, I favour an OSU-Michigan rematch.
Arkansas could make things interesting with wins over LSU and FLorida, especially if USC beats ND and lapses again against rival UCLA.
Notre Dame does not deserve to play for the national championship, even if they trample USC. I've been saying it since they got crushed by Michigan at home. There's no way they move ahead of Michigan. If they do, Kaiser, I'm with you in the down with the BCS movement.
OSU is in no matter what.
Michigan is in if USC loses or wins both games very unimpressively.
USC is in if they beat ND and UCLA solidly, at least by a TD each.
Florida if they win out in good fashion AND Arkansas beats LSU and USC loses
Arkansas - sorry, maybe next year
I'm hoping for a rematch, because they would be the best game. Granted, if Michigan wins, stir up the controversy pot. I don't see USC playing with OSU. They're been shaky against Pac-10 opponents. Put them against OSU and they'll get clobbered. Florida I see hanging around with a bit better than USC - they have essential a duel threat at QB and a good defense. However, they've been shaky at times, especially recently, noting the escape against South Carolina at home. Notre Dame - no. Arkansas can't overcome that 50-14 loss just like ND can't overcome their 47-21 loss.
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Arkansas has the advantage that their loss was in the season opener. An early loss is more easily overlooked than a late season loss. That being said, they need to win their 2 remaining games (which doesn't seem as unlikely as it did a few weeks ago), with ND losing to USC and UCLA upsetting USC.
I'm still not sold on Arkansas only because their loss, even though it was the season opener, was by 36 and at home and they weren't ranked in the preseason poll. It'd be extremely difficult to go from unranked to #2.
The only way I see ND playing for the national championship is if they go into the Coliseum and completey demolish USC in every single aspect of the game, winning bigger than they lost to Michigan. Ain't gonna happen. But, if it does, it would raise some questions: if people thought USC was legit enough to play for the title, and they get blown out by ND, what does that do for ND? If voters are willing to overlook a 50-14 drubbing at home in the season opener for Arkansas, why not a 47-21 defeat in the 3rd game (still early in the season) for ND? Just playing devil's advocate. :p Gotta love college football and the rankings and all the uncertainty brought about by it
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"Rust on a nail builds tetanus. Rust on a barbell builds character, strength, and attitude." -EC
"Don't spend your life wishing. Spend it doing." -FishrCutB8
"You're a mutant, like a snake with two heads or a cat shy one nipple. Be thankful that your mutation is helpful." - LD
I live in Michigan and go to a satellite U of M campus. However, in my mind, they blew it and should not go on to play OSU for the national championship. If college football had a playoff system, like it should, then Michigan would have likely been eliminated on Saturday. Shouldn't they play a third time to really determine who is the better team?
There also just seems to be something wrong with a system that allows 2 teams from the same conference play each other for the national championship.
In head-to-head play, Michigan lost. Another team should get a crack at OSU.
But, how can you fault Michigan for being in the same conference as the best team in the country? Did they get their crack at them? Yes. But just because they lost by 3 doesn't mean they got their shot and too bad. If, when the regular season is over, they are the 2nd best team in the nation, regardless of what conference they're from or that they lost to OSU already, they deserve the right the play for the national championship. My take: don't screw Michigan on the pretense of they had their shot and came up short. If, when it's all said and done, they're still the 2nd best team in the country, they should play for the title.
Think how different this arguement would be if the Michigan-Ohio State game was in the beginning of the season.
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"Rust on a nail builds tetanus. Rust on a barbell builds character, strength, and attitude." -EC
"Don't spend your life wishing. Spend it doing." -FishrCutB8
"You're a mutant, like a snake with two heads or a cat shy one nipple. Be thankful that your mutation is helpful." - LD
But, how can you fault Michigan for being in the same conference as the best team in the country? Did they get their crack at them? Yes. But just because they lost by 3 doesn't mean they got their shot and too bad. If, when the regular season is over, they are the 2nd best team in the nation, regardless of what conference they're from or that they lost to OSU already, they deserve the right the play for the national championship. My take: don't screw Michigan on the pretense of they had their shot and came up short. If, when it's all said and done, they're still the 2nd best team in the country, they should play for the title.
Those are pretty much my thoughts on the issue. Michigan lost to #1 by 3 points. If everyone else has a worse loss (and they do), at least as far as losses go, it would be hard to argue MI isn't to go to a national championship. You can argue the strength of wins side (which is what the BCS system is supposed to take into account), but not the loss, IMO.
I know a major arguing point for USC is that they have wins over quality opponents: Arkansas, Oregon, Nebraska, and Cal (the last 3 were ranked at the time of the game). However, despite Michigan's lack of quality opponents, they showed they can play with the best, so who cares who they played during the year. USC lost to an unranked Oregon State. Michigan lost to the #1 team. Michigan and OSU would both destroy USC. Michigan is the only team that can match with OSU. I wanna see them play again.
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"Rust on a nail builds tetanus. Rust on a barbell builds character, strength, and attitude." -EC
"Don't spend your life wishing. Spend it doing." -FishrCutB8
"You're a mutant, like a snake with two heads or a cat shy one nipple. Be thankful that your mutation is helpful." - LD
I think the bcs rankings are bogus. Michigan had their shot against the big dogs and they lost. So what they should get a second chance and if they win the rematch they win it all even though it would be 1-1 with those two? OSU vs UF. Its the game everyone wants to see.
An 8 team playoff (or any size playoff, for that matter) would ruin college football.
*Michigan and OSU would have likely pulled their starters, assured they'd end up in the top 8 as long as the game was decently close. Why risk injury when the *real* games were yet to come?
*Debates would ensue for the 6th, 7th, and 8th spots just the same as they come for the #2 spot here.
*The regular season in college football would not be nearly as dramatic and exciting.
And most of all...
*By having an 8-team playoff, you'd be giving an "equal shot" at the title to teams that frankly do not deserve it.*
To make my point, consider the latest BCS standings:
1. Ohio State
2. Michigan
3. USC
4. Florida
5. Notre Dame
6. Arkansas
7. West Virginia
8. Wisconsin
For argument's sake, let's look at the bottom 4 teams on that list.
In the 8th position, we have Wisconsin. They got beaten soundly by Michigan earlier this season. A playoff would put them on a level playing field with Michigan--meaning they'd both have equal shot at the title. Is that fair? Is that what *college* football is about? Let's forget it for the moment, and let's look at the next team on our list.
West Virginia currently sits in 7th place in the standings, but if my memory serves me... they lost to Louisville (another 1-loss team) who currently would not even make our 8-team playoff!!!! Louisville stomped WVU a few weeks ago, has the same record as WVU, and yet WVU would get the nod for our hypothetical playoff system. Is that fair? Let's avoid that question for a moment, and keep moving down the list...
Arkansas sits in the 6th position, meaning they'd make our 8-team playoff as well. To whom did they lose? Oh, that's right, they got shat on by USC... losing 50-14 earlier this season. Our hypothetical playoff would give Arkansas an equal shot at the title as USC--the very team that destroyed them already. If Arkansas were to win their half of the bracket, and USC was to lose on the other half, Arkansas could technically walk away with the title without a rematch against USC. Fair? OK, ok... let's forget about this for now and look at the next team on the list...
And in 5th place, we have Notre Dame. They'd make our playoff, despite having lost to Michigan earlier this year. Check that--they got *pounded* by Michigan at home, no less. A playoff system would give them an equal shot at the title. How would that be fair?!?!
A playoff would certainly work, but it would change the very nature of college football and it's regular season. D-1 college football is not the NFL. It's not college basketball, and it's not D-2 or D-3 college football. I like it that way.
Simply put, if you enjoy the excitement of college football's regular season, then a playoff system is not the answer. Teams have their chances each year, and they must make the most of the opportunities if they want to win the national title. You've got to approach it with a "one loss and you're out" mentality--and that's precisely what makes college football so damn exciting. It has the best regular season of *any* sport.
That said, I think we *should* accomodate some sort of "+1 Game" where any remaining unbeatens from major conferences will play an extra game, if necessary. For example, USC and Auburn would have played a bonus game two years ago to decide who won the title.
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*By having an 8-team playoff, you'd be giving an "equal shot" at the title to teams that frankly do not deserve it.*
bullshit
are you saying the ncaa basketball tournament ruined basketball?
because that has 64 teams in it... which have teams that would not be even ranked in the regular season. And, that is one of the most exciting times of the year for sports.
so if a cinderalla team makes it to the final 4, they don't deserve to be there, because they're not a top ranked team, right?
oh, and it would be fair b/c it would be a PLAYOFF
if a set of teams played off, the winners would be the ones who deserved to go to the championship game. it wouldn't matter about rankings like it does now. it would just matter if you got into the top 8, and the top ranked would have field advantage.... kind of like it is in every single sport.
are you saying the ncaa basketball tournament ruined basketball?
The problem with this analogy that does not apply to football is that you don't risk season-ending injury on quite the same level in the Big Dance compared to a college football game. Frankly, the nature of the sports dictate different requirements. In pro football, the talent level on the team is deep and everyone is experienced with years in college, and this is needed to cope with the expected injuries of a 16 game season and playoffs. In college, that is not the case and even a little attrition would take a great toll on a team.
Milkman, you've made some compelling arguments. We're going to scrap the entire system and change it so that you have a 'regular season' and a 'playoff season'? I think you are right - the D-I college football season IS one big playoff already where every game counts. Yeah, sure, let's trash that because the top 2 teams might end up playing each other twice just because they are from the same conference and had the bad luck of being good enough to go 1, 2. Sounds like cutting off the nose to spite the face.
The best part about college football is that each game is very important, in most seasons 1 loss and you're out. Unlike in the NFL where you really don't need to start watching until November. The bad part is that the whole bowl system has gotten out of hand, with a game in every mid-sized city it seems! Teams don't even have to have a winning season in some conferences.
I liked it when the bowls started around the 28 or 29 of December, with most games on New Year's. Then the game between 1 and 2 could be on the evening of Jan. 2.
are you saying the ncaa basketball tournament ruined basketball?
because that has 64 teams in it... which have teams that would not be even ranked in the regular season. And, that is one of the most exciting times of the year for sports.
so if a cinderalla team makes it to the final 4, they don't deserve to be there, because they're not a top ranked team, right?
bcs system is bogus and everyone knows it.
College basketball is what it is. It has a terribly boring and uneventful regular season, and yet it has a phenomenal postseason. College basketball is great in it's own right, but if I miss watching a regular season game, I won't exactly be upset.
College football is entirely different--entirely different than college basketball, entirely different than the NFL, and entirely different than any other sport because of the utter importance of every game. The postseason is lacking, for sure, but I personally would not trade the unbelievable regular season to incorporate some 8-game playoff. It would change the very nature of the sport, and frankly that's not something I want. It would basically become a JV version of the NFL... and then why not just watch the pros do it?
College football is great for the tradition, the rivalries, the fanfare, and for the unique importance of every last game. The season is on the brink *every* weekend, and accordingly I'll make damn sure I free up my schedule so that I can watch all the games.
__________________ You're not the only one improving yourself... I worked out with a dumbbell today -- I feel vigorous!!!
I think the BCS system should be canned.
OSU and USC should play in the Rose Bowl the way nature intended, because they are Pac-10 and Big-10 champions, not because of where they poll. That is college football - win your conference, go to the designated bowl game -- and sometimes let Notre Dame go to one
So, how do you determine the national championship? OSU goes undefeated. USC can technically end up with 3 losses and still make the Rose Bowl. Undefeated OSU vs. 3 loss USC. No way.
__________________
"Rust on a nail builds tetanus. Rust on a barbell builds character, strength, and attitude." -EC
"Don't spend your life wishing. Spend it doing." -FishrCutB8
"You're a mutant, like a snake with two heads or a cat shy one nipple. Be thankful that your mutation is helpful." - LD
what's the point of a National Championship title ? It's completely bogus. There's no tournament structure or playoff structure in college football.
If they want to rate teams and polls (like the old days ) fine - but there's nothing to "win" except your conference and your bowl game. at least not if I ran the world. College football isn't baseball, or basketball or hockey - or the NFL - its college football with its own way of doing things - tradition - they should've left it alone.
Milkman is an OSU fan. You can't possibly expect a rational argument for a playoff from an OSU fan because a) four games is just begging for an upset of a flawed OSU team and b) OSU fans are not the brightest people on earth.
And I only say that half in jest. the half being b. kinda.
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Milkman is an OSU fan. You can't possibly expect a rational argument for a playoff from an OSU fan because a) four games is just begging for an upset of a flawed OSU team and b) OSU fans are not the brightest people on earth.
And I only say that half in jest. the half being b. kinda.
In pro football, the talent level on the team is deep and everyone is experienced with years in college, and this is needed to cope with the expected injuries of a 16 game season and playoffs. In college, that is not the case and even a little attrition would take a great toll on a team.
wow, i didn't know that playing for long period of times and experience fixes muscle imbalances and prevents you from blowing an acl, or getting a concussion in a game.
by these standards, the people who play pee wee football should be injury proof by the time they reach college!
or were you referring to the deep benches in profootball?
injuries happen. that shouldn't be a reason why you shouldn't play. shorten the ncaa season, and change it into a playoff.
teams only played 9 games in 66'. now they play 12 games
How would an 8-team playoff ruin anything??? There is going to be a 1-loss team in the National Championship anyway. So, what is going to differentiate between the 8th-ranked 1-loss team and the 2nd-ranked 1-loss team?
I used to be a big fan of keeping the bowls the way they were, for tradition's sake. Well, all of the tradition has been shot out the window with the BCS. THe only way to get a true champion is with some form of a tournament. NCAA D-1 Football is the ONLY major sport in America that doesn't have a tournament to decide it's champion.
And the "too many games" theory just doesn't cut it with me. Every other college football level (and high schools) has tourneys (D-1AA, D-2, D-3, NAIA). The only reason D-1 doesn't is because of the money generated by the 32 bowl games. Here's my solution...
Keep most of the bowls the way they are (accept a couple weeks earlier), and turn the top 7 showcase bowl games into a BCS tournament with a rotating National Championship.
Milkman is an OSU fan. You can't possibly expect a rational argument for a playoff from an OSU fan because a) four games is just begging for an upset of a flawed OSU team and b) OSU fans are not the brightest people on earth.
And I only say that half in jest. the half being b. kinda.
I wouldn't mess with the milkman. OSU fans are SCARY passionate.
BCS Championship Game
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