Frank gets strong.

[Simon C]

Originally Posted by Matthew

I didn't say never put her in gear, I said don't put her in gear yet.
Let her get a bit stronger first.

Yeah I don't think Frank would wait anyway

I'm with you though Matthew, I think people need more of a base of strength and technique, and experience, before they get into equipment

[Frank.S]

Originally Posted by Simon C

I think that you need to train more in gear in double and triply ply federations, than you would in single ply. I think more than 2 weeks for single ply still ofcourse...

But we spend about the last 4 weeks or so I think in gear before a meet, but then again we follow a linearly periodisation system of training. I think the westside and MM moethods of training are more applicable to multi-ply federations too, aswell as non-drug tested feds, as they are much more taxing on the bodys recovery abilities.

We have a big powerlifting club here, and their coach only lets them into bench shirts like 1 week out from the meets lolz... They would gain alot to train more in their gear I think!!!

There isn't much difference between single and double ply these days i dont htink. Bench is pretty much the same thing because the single ply lifters can wear tighter shirts, deadlift makes no difference and half the reason double ply guys squat more is the fact they can use a mono-lift and not go as deep.

The numbers between the IPF and APF are not that much different anymore because the single ply gear has gotten so good.

Originally Posted by Matthew

I didn't say never put her in gear, I said don't put her in gear yet.
Let her get a bit stronger first.

Why would that be an advantage? So she would have to deal with more weight when she starts using gear and have established incorrect geared grooves? thats silly if your goal is powerlifting.

Originally Posted by Simon C

Yeah I don't think Frank would wait anyway

I'm with you though Matthew, I think people need more of a base of strength and technique, and experience, before they get into equipment

I respectfully disagree

If your goal is powerlifting, gear up because thats part of the sport. It would be like entering your first mountain bike race on foot because you 'want to learn the terrain and get a base of cardiovascular endurance' hahaha.

[Simon C]

Originally Posted by Frank.S

If your goal is powerlifting, gear up because thats part of the sport. It would be like entering your first mountain bike race on foot because you 'want to learn the terrain and get a base of cardiovascular endurance' hahaha.

Uhhh... not quite...


If somebody with shit technique got into a bench shirt or squat suit for the first time it would fuck them up bigtime imo. Getting into a bench shirt especially, they would either kill themselves, or survive and just fucking hate the gear as they get no good reps in. I think being introduced to the equipment you have to have a certain level of experience, and a good training environment too will help with this.

Even though I haven't got any good reps in my new shirt yet, I know I've just been miss grooving it, and that pretty soon I'll hit the sweet spot and the bar will just fly up. A novice would be fucked from that I think, plus I have good experience training partners that can actually tell me I miss grooved the bar(I'm pressing it forward rather than back towards my chest).

And I'm not saying your gf isn't ready for gear, by the sounds of it she probably is.

Having said that, I'm entering my first PL contest in full gear But I think my technique was good enough, and I had enough experience to get into the equipment at that point, and for squats and deads the equipment has been really good to me(especially squats, and it hasn't even gotten hard yet lol), bench shirts, well I'll feel the same once I get a good rep in lol! My shirt right now scares me a bit!

[Frank.S]

raw technique has about 0% to do with geared technique imo.

If you want to get good in gear you need to train in it primarily. If I had trained with gear for my first meet I would be a better powerlifter today.

The amount of air you need to take is different, ability to stay tight is improved but different, bar placement different, every lift feels way different, etc etc

I have no problem with raw powerlifting, in all honesty it makes more sense. But, thats not where the best lifters are or the most meets, or the best meets.

she is ready for gear you guys make her sound weak haha. She will probably deadlift low-mid 300s..

[Matthew]

Just because the top lifters use gear doesn't mean she has to.

Just because you use gear and want to be one of the top lifters doesn't mean she has to wear gear as well.

There are a ton of lifters who lift raw. If she doesn't want to be at the top of the worlds lifters, she can lift raw and still win some competitions.

Putting her in a bench shirt when she's benching 135 is stupid in my opinion. Why not get her some more time under the bar so she can learn proper technique without gear before you get her learning proper technique with gear.

I vividly remember you saying you didn't want to use gear until you lifted a certain amount raw. What happened to that?

[Matthew]

Even if she wants to and does get to the top of the sport, do you think at that point - the peak of her career - it will matter if she wore gear to her first meet?
It won't matter. Let her do one raw, and then let her decide if she wants to wear gear or not.

You can't rush into it.

And gear isn't inevitably a part of powerlifting. It's a part of one type of powerlifting - geared powerlifting. That's it. You don't have to wear gear.

[Frank.S]

Originally Posted by Matthew

Just because the top lifters use gear doesn't mean she has to.

Just because you use gear and want to be one of the top lifters doesn't mean she has to wear gear as well.

There are a ton of lifters who lift raw. If she doesn't want to be at the top of the worlds lifters, she can lift raw and still win some competitions.

Putting her in a bench shirt when she's benching 135 is stupid in my opinion. Why not get her some more time under the bar so she can learn proper technique without gear before you get her learning proper technique with gear.

I vividly remember you saying you didn't want to use gear until you lifted a certain amount raw. What happened to that?

You dont lift with many girls, few girls could bench 135lbs and have it pass in a contest. I would probably consider that pretty close to a 315lbs bench for a guy. Few people can do it without training.

I was wrong with learning to lift raw first. I see zero point in that now. Gear is way to hard to learn. It takes such a long time to get good at it that you need lots of time in it. The more time in it, the better.

Actually she probably wont use a bench shirt for the contest as its rapidly approaching and there isn't really enough time to train with it and learn it.

[Frank.S]

Originally Posted by Matthew

Even if she wants to and does get to the top of the sport, do you think at that point - the peak of her career - it will matter if she wore gear to her first meet?
It won't matter. Let her do one raw, and then let her decide if she wants to wear gear or not.

You can't rush into it.

And gear isn't inevitably a part of powerlifting. It's a part of one type of powerlifting - geared powerlifting. That's it. You don't have to wear gear.

You see, by wearing gear she will actually 100% for sure be benefiting her geared lifts, by lifting raw it could potentially be almost throwing away months of training because you may not get the carryover.

Geared lifting, today, is powerlifting. Look at plusa, powerliftingwatch etc its all geared. I doubt there is a raw meet within 20 hours drive of me in the next year.. and if there is, about 4 people will show up and they will have an argument about if belts and knee wraps are 'raw'.

[Matthew]

Few guys could bench 135 and have it pass in a contest as well, without any training.

A 135 bench for a girl is NOT equal to 315 for a guy, that's ridiculous. 225-245, maybe.

If you keep training in gear all the time, you'll eventually have a huge weakness in the lower end of the ROM.
That would be the same as your average gym rat doing only quarter squats. Forget everything I've said about gear, this just isn't healthy for your body.

[Frank.S]

Originally Posted by Matthew

Few guys could bench 135 and have it pass in a contest as well, without any training.

A 135 bench for a girl is NOT equal to 315 for a guy, that's ridiculous. 225-245, maybe.

If you keep training in gear all the time, you'll eventually have a huge weakness in the lower end of the ROM.
That would be the same as your average gym rat doing only quarter squats. Forget everything I've said about gear, this just isn't healthy for your body.

if you exclude her gender and just go by bodyweight, thats like me pressing 230+lbs. Gender plays a role in terms of strength of course. I still think the comparison is pretty valid. Comparisons like this are dumb because there are so many factors.

Healthy? putting 800lbs on your back is not healthy no matter what way you look at it. Excerting yourself until your eyes pop (still, mine are fully bloodshot from contest deads) and blood shots out your nose, not healthy. Snorting ammonia before every big lift.. that cant be good either. This is not a healthy sport at all.

It would be more like the average gym rat doing regular depth squats with 100lbs of chains on the bar then a 1/4 squat if anything. And hey, if someone in the gym is doing 800lbs quarter squats, good for them.

[Matthew]

Ok, the chain argument is a good one. That is a better comparison.

I don't want to sound sexist, but I doubt she'll be putting 800lbs on her back.
Still, I guess you have a valid point again.

I have an idea. Why don't I just stop arguing against the use of gear...

[Frank.S]

man, thats not sexest, ive never met a girl who wouldn't fold up like a pretzle with 800lbs.

we can agree to disagree.

[cycomiko]

Originally Posted by Frank.S

The numbers between the IPF and APF are not that much different anymore because the single ply gear has gotten so good.

hahahahhahahahahahahahahahahah ahahahahahaha


oh,


where you not joking?


oh...

[Simon C]

Originally Posted by Frank.S

raw technique has about 0% to do with geared technique imo.

If you want to get good in gear you need to train in it primarily. If I had trained with gear for my first meet I would be a better powerlifter today.

The amount of air you need to take is different, ability to stay tight is improved but different, bar placement different, every lift feels way different, etc etc

I have no problem with raw powerlifting, in all honesty it makes more sense. But, thats not where the best lifters are or the most meets, or the best meets.

she is ready for gear you guys make her sound weak haha. She will probably deadlift low-mid 300s..

As I said earlier, I wasn't making any statements directly related to your gf, I'm sure shes real strong And will do great in gear.

But I guess I'm talking about basic technique/strength, if somebody hasn't developed the proper coordination for it and such. And also the mental side, but in the case of your gf, well you can help her there.

And, you just said she is ready for gear, which implies there is something to be read for Got ya!!!

Originally Posted by Matthew

Just because the top lifters use gear doesn't mean she has to.

Just because you use gear and want to be one of the top lifters doesn't mean she has to wear gear as well.

There are a ton of lifters who lift raw. If she doesn't want to be at the top of the worlds lifters, she can lift raw and still win some competitions.

Putting her in a bench shirt when she's benching 135 is stupid in my opinion. Why not get her some more time under the bar so she can learn proper technique without gear before you get her learning proper technique with gear.

I vividly remember you saying you didn't want to use gear until you lifted a certain amount raw. What happened to that?

Originally Posted by Frank.S

You dont lift with many girls, few girls could bench 135lbs and have it pass in a contest. I would probably consider that pretty close to a 315lbs bench for a guy. Few people can do it without training.

I was wrong with learning to lift raw first. I see zero point in that now. Gear is way to hard to learn. It takes such a long time to get good at it that you need lots of time in it. The more time in it, the better.

Actually she probably wont use a bench shirt for the contest as its rapidly approaching and there isn't really enough time to train with it and learn it.

Matthew you probably don't train with any girls hah.

But Frank is right in that a 135bench for a girl is pretty good! But shit, nowhere near a 315lbs bench!!!

Originally Posted by Matthew

Few guys could bench 135 and have it pass in a contest as well, without any training.

A 135 bench for a girl is NOT equal to 315 for a guy, that's ridiculous. 225-245, maybe.

If you keep training in gear all the time, you'll eventually have a huge weakness in the lower end of the ROM.
That would be the same as your average gym rat doing only quarter squats. Forget everything I've said about gear, this just isn't healthy for your body.

I do agree you will develop a certain type of strength adn weaknesses training in gear over time. Probably not in the way I train, which is raw most of the time, and introducing the gear in stages in the last 4 weeks before a contest. But definitely in a westside approach.

Originally Posted by Frank.S

if you exclude her gender and just go by bodyweight, thats like me pressing 230+lbs. Gender plays a role in terms of strength of course. I still think the comparison is pretty valid. Comparisons like this are dumb because there are so many factors.

Healthy? putting 800lbs on your back is not healthy no matter what way you look at it. Excerting yourself until your eyes pop (still, mine are fully bloodshot from contest deads) and blood shots out your nose, not healthy. Snorting ammonia before every big lift.. that cant be good either. This is not a healthy sport at all.

It would be more like the average gym rat doing regular depth squats with 100lbs of chains on the bar then a 1/4 squat if anything. And hey, if someone in the gym is doing 800lbs quarter squats, good for them.

Frank, your 315lbs comparrison was so shit If you want to know the exact equivalent according to wilks points. say that 13bench for a 60kg woman? Well thats equivalent of a 198lbs man benching 235, so yes 230+ But NOWHERE NEAR 315!!!!!

And healthy? who ever said powerlifting was healthy lol!!! It's most certainly NOT!!!

Originally Posted by Matthew

Ok, the chain argument is a good one. That is a better comparison.

I don't want to sound sexist, but I doubt she'll be putting 800lbs on her back.
Still, I guess you have a valid point again.

I have an idea. Why don't I just stop arguing against the use of gear...

Originally Posted by Frank.S

man, thats not sexest, ive never met a girl who wouldn't fold up like a pretzle with 800lbs.

we can agree to disagree.

Hahaha yeah, I agree with that one too. Girls just can't lfit that much, seriosuly.

I train with a woman who placed 5th in the world at the 2005 IPF world championships in the 60(132lbs)kg class. 325 squat, 198lbs bench, 360 deadlift, now shit that's 5th in the world, amazing lifts for a woman.

But compare that to the guy who came 5th in the 60kg class that year... 484 squat, 350 bench, 440 deadlift.

Girls DO fold under 800lbs

Originally Posted by cycomiko

hahahahhahahahahahahahahahahah ahahahahahaha


oh,


where you not joking?


oh...

Hahahhahahahahha!!! funny!!!

Yeah, the numbers are still wayyyy different lol, well except in the deadlift hah!