I teach 7th and 8th grade English and Social Studies, and am also pursuing a degree in reading instruction. There is an ongoing debate at my school over the appropriate amount of homework for 13 and 14 year old kids. Some teachers give 30 minutes a night. Some give closer to an hour. Some give none. Some parents hate all homework, some assign additional essays or research projects to their children (much of that is driven by private tutoring). What are your thoughts?
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I taught for over 10 years at the middle school level. As a teacher, I'm a fan of homework...... I'm a parent and I'm a fan of homework............ my kids (4 and 6) work on schoolwork during the summer at least 4 days a week.
I also believe it depends on the child and their level in school.
You teach English and Social Studies.... I definitely think there should be more homework in English and Math than say... Health. JMO
I think it works best for there to be enough class time to finish everything, then if you are slacking in class/chatting you are going to be doing some homework if you need the marks.
Even at a university/college level i dont think most people are willing to put in another hour of homework after they get home.
How many subjects are these kids taking? You mention some teachers think an hour is appropriate, but if they're taking, say, five subjects (math, English, science, social studies, one elective like music, Spanish or business) that's five hours of homework, which seems a bit much. A half hour seems more appropriate to me.
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as a student and not a parent, i always thought the homework load in my grade school was ridiculous. They would give us a few hours of homework a night, and told us that "it was in preparation for high school." Got to high school, and the work load was barely anything.
I went to a Catholic grade school and a Catholic high school, so i don't think one can blame it being a private school as getting more homework. Now in college, i virtually have no homework except for studying for exams.
I think 30min-1hr of homework a night is the most kids should get. The idea that a lot of parents get that it keeps them out of trouble is retarded. If the parents watched their kids then they wouldn't be getting in trouble.
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I am pretty against regular homework. My kids are in elementary, my oldest just started middle school. I agree with Bill's point, that is a lot to pile on if you combine the subjects. My kids are in school all day, they get one recess, even in elementary and PE is only once a week. I want time after school for them to be able to read a book for enjoyment, play outside with neighborhood friends, do a sport... Of course, my kids all perform above grade level so maybe that is why I don't see a need for it.
I am not against all homework, just having it every night, in every subject. I think it is ridiculous.
Depends on the kind of homework and whether it's crap that is just busy work or actually worth something and reinforces what was taught. Some kids need extra practice, some don't. Prolly all kids need a certain amount of homework because the need to learn habits that will help later in college, assuming they go.
A set amount of time is stupid. A worksheet or a reading and some questions I'd find acceptable, esp if those reinforced the classwork that day, or previewed the classwork the next day so you can have intelligent, meaningful conversation in class. But a set time punishes the smart/fast kids and doesn't do much for the average or slow kids. Whose time estimate are you gonna use?
The worst teachers I had assigned a lot of homework. It's like they expected that would fill the gap of their crappy teaching style of "say it over and over and over the same way till the kids box their own ears." The best teachers I had gave suggested homework for those who had issues or wanted more practice, and didn't want it handed in and graded. Those teachers actually helped children learn, rather than talked at them all day. Crazy idea, I know.
Frankly a child shouldn't be bogged down home every day with hours upon hours of homework, then readings, then papers to write, then studying for the test.
But you have a crappy subject to teach in that there Social Studies. No offense.
I think it works best for there to be enough class time to finish everything, then if you are slacking in class/chatting you are going to be doing some homework if you need the marks.
Even at a university/college level i dont think most people are willing to put in another hour of homework after they get home.
I agree w/ you as well...... But if you have a class that runs 50 minutes, you barely have enough time to get through attendance, warm ups, review, lesson and classwork/homework. Plus w/ 30 + students in a class... it's hard.
Our district went on a block for a few years ... 1- 4 peroids one day, then 5 - 8 the next. Each class ran for 1.5 hours. The homework was cut down trastically. The district thought it was too expensive, so they took the schools off block. go figure!
Even at a university/college level i dont think most people are willing to put in another hour of homework after they get home.
Really? Then when do you actually do your reading or project work or papers? An hour a day would be SWEET. I have projects that have me spending an awful lot more than that.
Oh, wait. You're a biz degree, iirc. THAT explains it.
I can't remember how much we got. When I went to Jr high & high school, both schools used flexible modular scheduling. Jr High more structured time than high school. One free mod per day - otherwise your free mods were in a resource center or the library (or gym in hs). We got most of our homework done at school - so little was left over for after school or nights. Mostly reading assignments or writing papers.
On Tuesdays in jr high we had "math lab" - open math resource center like from 7-9:30PM - and I remember going there to do math so maybe we just didn't do our math homework at school that day.
I can't remember how much we got. When I went to Jr high & high school, both schools used flexible modular scheduling. Jr High more structured time than high school. One free mod per day - otherwise your free mods were in a resource center or the library (or gym in hs). We got most of our homework done at school - so little was left over for after school or nights. Mostly reading assignments or writing papers.
On Tuesdays in jr high we had "math lab" - open math resource center like from 7-9:30PM - and I remember going there to do math so maybe we just didn't do our math homework at school that day.
This is actually a great idea.......... Kids attend tutoring afterschool, but sometimes they need a few hours to decompress....... The last thing kids want to do is spend more time working after they've been at school for 7 hours! I think this would be beneficial for a lot of students... if you could get them in the building!!! ha ha ha
Great feedback so far; thank you.
I should add that I teach in a private school and I have no more than 17 kids in a class at any time. The middle school students have 6 academic subjects (most meet every day), plus drama, p.e., music, and art, and any of those classes can assign homework too.
I suppose I should add my own opinion, too, about homework in general. I think homework should be used as practice for things like grammar and math, and that a few "problems" per night-- whatever amount is going to help the kid get the concept-- is appropriate. I think reading homework is appropriate, to some degree, moreso if the book is chosen by the student. In my class, most writing assignments are well-supported with class time, so the only "homework" is to complete whatever they did not finish in the (very generous, imo) work time. As a rule, I am opposed to "x number of minutes" of homework, because, as someone mentioned, kids work at different rates, and 1 hour for one student could easily turn into 5 hours for another.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Erika
I am pretty against regular homework. My kids are in elementary, my oldest just started middle school. I agree with Bill's point, that is a lot to pile on if you combine the subjects. My kids are in school all day, they get one recess, even in elementary and PE is only once a week. I want time after school for them to be able to read a book for enjoyment, play outside with neighborhood friends, do a sport... Of course, my kids all perform above grade level so maybe that is why I don't see a need for it.
I am not against all homework, just having it every night, in every subject. I think it is ridiculous.
I agree, for the most part. We've tossed around several different homework schemas, like Math and Science on T/Th nights and other subjects on M/W/F nights, but most teachers argue that they need more flexibility (and I agree, that things come up that prevent me from getting through my planned lesson).
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aoife
But you have a crappy subject to teach in that there Social Studies. No offense.
I completely agreed with your whole post until you got to this part! First, one can't be a (good) middle school teacher and not have a thick skin, so know that I am not the least bit offended. In fact, upon hearing that I teach middle school, most people respond with something like "what? You couldn't get a real job teaching high school?" and are flabbergasted to hear that I actually chose middle school. Social studies is my favorite subject; we talk about people, which is not only fascinating to me as a subject, but which also fosters amazingly complex and enlightening (not to mention entertaining) conversations among kids at that age.
And Alco-- I've been a college student for going on 13 years, and I still have more than an hour of homework a night!
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This is actually a great idea.......... Kids attend tutoring afterschool, but sometimes they need a few hours to decompress....... The last thing kids want to do is spend more time working after they've been at school for 7 hours! I think this would be beneficial for a lot of students... if you could get them in the building!!! ha ha ha
Agreed, but I can't imagine getting my students back into school in the evenings!
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Are you not considering assigned reading homework?
Only thing ive ever had to read is sci journals, Usually i'll just read the conclusions to be honest. Even if I read the whole thing, its not going to take very long.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aoife
Really? Then when do you actually do your reading or project work or papers? An hour a day would be SWEET. I have projects that have me spending an awful lot more than that.
Oh, wait. You're a biz degree, iirc. THAT explains it.
1-2 hours per week is pushing it for me as far as homework goes to be honest. Im a dual major (computer science + geography.. yes, they are related).
projects - do what you are good at with them. For me this is usually programming something or something to do with technology. Ive only ever done 1 project that i would consider serious for college (submitted to intl journal etc) there was plenty of class time.
papers - write down some ideas (tip: look into the profs research and reference the hell out of that + their references whenever possible), make a rough draft and offer to "help" someone with their computer assignment if they "help" you with editing your paper. turn your weaknesses into your skills
I completely agreed with your whole post until you got to this part! First, one can't be a (good) middle school teacher and not have a thick skin, so know that I am not the least bit offended. In fact, upon hearing that I teach middle school, most people respond with something like "what? You couldn't get a real job teaching high school?" and are flabbergasted to hear that I actually chose middle school. Social studies is my favorite subject; we talk about people, which is not only fascinating to me as a subject, but which also fosters amazingly complex and enlightening (not to mention entertaining) conversations among kids at that age.
One of my best friends from HS is a middle school math teacher, and yes, she *chose* middle school. heh. But I remember her commenting in the beginning on the same thing, people like "you can't do HS?"
I don't think social studies is a crappy subject to study. I think it's a crappy one to teach. There's few and far between good SS teachers that I've seen. It very easily becomes all about the dates and names and little else. The actual CONTENT is amazingly interesting, and it only gets more so when you get older and get to delve into particular areas of study. But I've noticed that it's too easy for teachers to test facts that mean nothing, rather than concepts and relationships that provide a good understanding of humanity and culture.
Maybe it's that the teachers that I've had issues with are just not interested in the subject, or think kids aren't.
1-2 hours per week is pushing it for me as far as homework goes to be honest. Im a dual major (computer science + geography.. yes, they are related).
projects - do what you are good at with them. For me this is usually programming something or something to do with technology. Ive only ever done 1 project that i would consider serious for college (submitted to intl journal etc) there was plenty of class time.
papers - write down some ideas (tip: look into the profs research and reference the hell out of that + their references whenever possible), make a rough draft and offer to "help" someone with their computer assignment if they "help" you with editing your paper. turn your weaknesses into your skills
Lol. I'm very good at what I do. But it's impossible to not spend time on a design project, it shows. Papers are a no brainer, I shit those out in a couple hours the night before they're due... and actually do my own "editing."
I think it works best for there to be enough class time to finish everything, then if you are slacking in class/chatting you are going to be doing some homework if you need the marks
Quote:
Originally Posted by Erika
I am pretty against regular homework. ... I want time after school for them to be able to read a book for enjoyment, play outside with neighborhood friends, do a sport... Of course, my kids all perform above grade level so maybe that is why I don't see a need for it.
I am not against all homework, just having it every night, in every subject. I think it is ridiculous.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LisaS
We got most of our homework done at school - so little was left over for after school or nights. Mostly reading assignments or writing papers.
On Tuesdays in jr high we had "math lab" - open math resource center like from 7-9:30PM
I'm identifying with these comments. My youngest will be a senior this year. Both my kids were/are straight A students. If they can get their homework done in class, then please let them.
I don't get how you can give "30 minutes" of homework. What if my kid can do it in 10? What if another kid needs an hour to do the same page? I've got no problem with covering a topic thoroughly, and if homework is needed to accomplish that, then fine. But don't give busy work just so you can say you gave homework. That's silly too.
There are so many after school activities that are also important to a child development--sports, piano, etc. They've been sitting down in an academic setting for HOURS already. They need some diversity in their lives! They need time to just play, too.
My son's school has their math lab available before school rather than at night. You can go early, like 7:00, and get with one of the teachers. My son took advantage of that a lot last year.
Papers, essays, reading assignments, etc., sure, go ahead and expect them to do those things as homework. It's the busy work that upset me, or this idea that there HAS to be homework of some kind. Use it when it's needed.
One of my best friends from HS is a middle school math teacher, and yes, she *chose* middle school. heh. But I remember her commenting in the beginning on the same thing, people like "you can't do HS?"
I don't think social studies is a crappy subject to study. I think it's a crappy one to teach. There's few and far between good SS teachers that I've seen. It very easily becomes all about the dates and names and little else. The actual CONTENT is amazingly interesting, and it only gets more so when you get older and get to delve into particular areas of study. But I've noticed that it's too easy for teachers to test facts that mean nothing, rather than concepts and relationships that provide a good understanding of humanity and culture.
Maybe it's that the teachers that I've had issues with are just not interested in the subject, or think kids aren't.
You might love my class... the first thing I tell kids on the first day of the year, is that I'll never ask them to memorize a single name or date. We talk about / learn about ideas and trends and art and music and causes and effects. I don't give a rats ass if they can name all the presidents, as long as they know, for example, which president first adopted the notion of manifest destiny. And, of course, can thoughtfully and effectively communicate their own ideas about manifest destiny in a variety of ways.
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Lol. I'm very good at what I do. But it's impossible to not spend time on a design project, it shows. Papers are a no brainer, I shit those out in a couple hours the night before they're due... and actually do my own "editing."
Me too. I'm in online "grad school" (hence the homework question) and I give myself four hours on Saturday mornings to complete my work, whether it's a 3-page paper or a 20-page paper. Some of my cohort members obsess each week, and I don't really get it.
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I don't get how you can give "30 minutes" of homework. What if my kid can do it in 10? What if another kid needs an hour to do the same page? I've got no problem with covering a topic thoroughly, and if homework is needed to accomplish that, then fine. But don't give busy work just so you can say you gave homework. That's silly too.
There are so many after school activities that are also important to a child development--sports, piano, etc. They've been sitting down in an academic setting for HOURS already. They need some diversity in their lives! They need time to just play, too.
My son's school has their math lab available before school rather than at night. You can go early, like 7:00, and get with one of the teachers. My son took advantage of that a lot last year.
Papers, essays, reading assignments, etc., sure, go ahead and expect them to do those things as homework. It's the busy work that upset me, or this idea that there HAS to be homework of some kind. Use it when it's needed.
Lisa, to be clear, I completely agree with you. I butt heads with our math and science teachers all the time because it seems as though they pile on homework "to prepare the kids for high school" (hell, I NEVER did any homework in high school!). It drives me crazy. I really appreciate the well-rounded students who work hard at their chosen endeavors, outside of school. They are interesting, and add valuable perspective to the classroom.
Over-scheduled kids... now that's a whole other can of worms!
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In fact, upon hearing that I teach middle school, most people respond with something like "what? You couldn't get a real job teaching high school?" and are flabbergasted to hear that I actually chose middle school. Social studies is my favorite subject; we talk about people, which is not only fascinating to me as a subject, but which also fosters amazingly complex and enlightening (not to mention entertaining) conversations among kids at that age.
I've never heard that one.... I always get "how can you teach middle school? The kids are crazy at that age!!!"
In fact, I love that age group. My favorite subject to teach was Health. I had to teach Healthy Sexuality and at first I was very scared. But after a few times of saying "penis" and "vagina"... it was no big deal! The kids were so open and had so many great questions. It's amazing what kids *think* is true from watching tv or from friends.
Teaching health was a great experience. I was never closer to my students on a personal level than when I taught health. We had so many debates and covered such great topics throughout the semester. I had so many awesome projects going on. Too bad the number of students in my class increased from 25 - 34 in just a few short years. I felt like I was really making a difference. I'm still in contact with several of my former students. They were awesome and I miss them!
*** sorrt for my long winded post... just passionate about kids
BTW.. you are so blessed to have 17 in a class. The learning that must go on is probably so incredible!!!
I taught 7th grade math, science, literature for 15 years.
I didn't give homework every night, but did find it useful at times.
Of course, I also gave assignements like this:
1) Take a blanket and go out in the yard. Lie down and stare at the stars for 15 minutes. The next day we discussed what they saw.
2) When you are sitting at the dinner table tonight, ask your parents why the table is more nothing than it is something. (A prelude to discussing the atom)
I occassionally gave written assignments just to assess their work habits.
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I taught 7th grade math, science, literature for 15 years.
I didn't give homework every night, but did find it useful at times.
Of course, I also gave assignements like this:
1) Take a blanket and go out in the yard. Lie down and stare at the stars for 15 minutes. The next day we discussed what they saw.
ha - in 8th grade science we had to keep a moon journal. We had to go out and observe it every night, note the date, the time, the conditions and describe the phase (waxing, waning, gibbous, new), describe the position in the sky, if any other night sky items were near it, etc.
I loved that class.
I would have loved for you to teach my kids Mahler! It's teachers who peak their interest that are the best IMO.
Graham took an elective class called Intro to Engineering. They had a small project in class building a desktop hovercraft. He fell in love and wanted to build a big one. His teacher not only encouraged him, but got other students involved, helped with the cost, and let him demonstrate it at the school. Everyone in the class who wanted got a ride. They did all the construction at our house because of the power tools involved, but she let him run with it, you know? That was the cool thing. She encouraged him to figure out how to make it hold a person. It wasn't a core class, but he got so much out of it.
I always had too much homework and not enough time. I really think that it helped me with time management. Not that it helped me get it done in time, but I managed to learn what needed to be done when and what I could do in other classes, and what would happen if I missed one homework in my classes that I was getting good grades it. That helped in college, as it helped me figure out what to get done and when.
So I guess that I appreciated the homework load because I still had a great time in school (always playing sports and in the theatre or being the mascot) and still got good grades because it helped me figure out how to organize my life.
ha - in 8th grade science we had to keep a moon journal. We had to go out and observe it every night, note the date, the time, the conditions and describe the phase (waxing, waning, gibbous, new), describe the position in the sky, if any other night sky items were near it, etc.
I loved that class.
i had that too, in i think the 8th grade.. luckily, the internet was invented by then
I always thought social studies was the most interesting real course (outdoor ed probally doesnt count). I did have a fantastic high school social studies teacher who was really-actually interested in what she taught. She was an older lady who talked very proper, she would get so worked up when talking current events that she would sometimes drop the F-bomb in disgust of the situation and then excuse herself from the class.
My kids are not to this age yet, 3rd and 5th grade now. But I NEVER did homework. We either had time in our class to get it done or I did not do it. Between sports practices and games and other school activities I did not give it a priority. I always just took a zero if I did not have time to do it at school. My grade could have been better, yes. But I was still in the top 3rd due to my tests and exam scores. My parents used to call the school to see if I even owned books.
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Ha. that was me. I just didn't see a need to bother. I did assignments that mattered, like book reading (english class, most of the novels I hadn't read yet, because who the hell WANTS to read Les Mis) and like papers/reports/etc. But like "normal" homework, pfft. That was for people that needed it, imo.
For parents, a question about homework
). I did have a fantastic high school social studies teacher who was really-actually interested in what she taught. She was an older lady who talked very proper, she would get so worked up when talking current events that she would sometimes drop the F-bomb in disgust of the situation and then excuse herself from the class. 
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