Watching the Olympics this past week a few incidents made it abundantly clear how important the mental aspect is in separating the winners from the...
Witness Lindsey Jacob-Ellis last night who was clearly on her way to a Gold Medal in Women's Snowboard Cross when on the last jump she tried to show off a bit and ended up falling and coming in second.
Apollo Ohno last week had an excellent opportunity to pass in his 1500M short track qualifier but didn't get it done. He clearly has the ability but made a mental mistake and was eliminated.
Then his girlfriend in her race had a golden opportunity to pass her opponant yet put on the breaks instead and was out.
Bode Miller.
Michelle Kwan.
Enough said.
Then witness the Korean & Chinese short track skaters who just plain get it done everytime. No matter if they are in first or last in the first lap they find a way to win.
Snowboarder Seth Wescott is another that was fun to watch because he displayed pure mental toughness in head to head competition.
I've been disgusted with the lack of mental discipline and toughness shown by US athletes. Yes, they are very gifted, very talented and have done a lot of hard work and shown perseverance to get to where they are. But somethng is definitely lacking. Perhaps it's a lack of indomitable spirit, as it's called in taekwondo. In any case, getting it done is key. I think many of them have been just not-lazy enough to get to where they are. Then, given the right circumstances, their laziness sneaks out. Eventually, everyone gets just enough rope to hang themselves.
I've heard an argument that Jacobellis's thing is demonstrative of some sort of 'snowboarding attitude.' She showboated, blew it, and then didn't show a whole lot of remorse, basically saying 'hey, i had a good time.'
I don't necessarily agree with the 'snowboarding attitude' bit (i don't follow the sport at all), but it does irritate me that Jacobellis wasn't at least a little upset with what she did. If she wants to showboat, do it on the X-games. When she's got 'U.S.A.' on her uniform, win the frickin' event first, then showboat later if you want to.
I'm in agreement with all that you guys said. With the exception of Michelle Kwan. It would have been worse to compete hurt and fail to give another athlete a shot at it.
It's hard to know whether she should have passed a couple weeks back, though.
But, contrast all these guys with those female downhill skiers who crashed during practice, went into the hospital, then still gave it their best shots on the big day.
During the 1500m skate that little guy...Korean/Chinese, I forget which...was basically told "to win". No showboating, no attitude, he hit the ice and nailed it. FLUIDLY. Those guy seem to take their sport seriously. Look at some of ours, Bode is more interested in Miller Lite than winning (or so it seems).
When I was competitively cycling my life evolved around it. I ate it, slept it, lived it. A night out on the town might be fun but I'd pay if I had a race the next day.
Save the "good times" for X Games. Or, better yet, have an open night like the skaters do where they don't get judged - let 'em have fun. That is usually the best show.
You guys are just mean. The important thing is that they made it to the Olympics, and they should just enjoy themselves while they are there. It's the experience and having fun that's important, not winning!
I don't know about that, Dave. These athletes are now ambassadors of the USA; they're no longer in it just for themselves when they're competing at the Olympics. So, I agree that they should just "get 'er done". Focus, play it straight, and friggin' fight for every last second.
Then again, we can easily sit back here and second-guess these athletes. There's a tremendous amount of pressure on them that many of us just can't even begin to imagine. Kuri's got it right though. There appears to be a lack of mental toughness.
The only exception I have to kuri's examples is Michelle Kwan. She was checked out by an Olympic physician and advised of a groin pull. She showed extreme maturity when she made the decision to pull out and open up a spot for another competitor to take her place in plenty of time prior to the event.
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You guys are just mean. The important thing is that they made it to the Olympics, and they should just enjoy themselves while they are there. It's the experience and having fun that's important, not winning!
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I DO agree with you that winning at all cost is NOT the important thing.. but "not doing a person's best" and "not doing it because of the Snowboard mentality" although it might get her (him? I read it quickly) a publicity contract.. is not showing what the O's are about (IMHO). I think the O's are Trying thier best to win in all fairplay.
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You guys are just mean. The important thing is that they made it to the Olympics, and they should just enjoy themselves while they are there. It's the experience and having fun that's important, not winning!
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I've always been more proud of our Olympians who finish dead last than the ones who actually win. Strange but true. What chaps my hide though is when we have an athlete who has won the event, she had the Gold medal wrapped up, and then LOST IT because she was dicking around at the finish line. What put it over the top was afterward, she basically shrugged her shoulders and gave us a half-hearted 'My bad.' That's not going to cut it with me. I doubt she really cares though.
Michelle Kwan is a joke. She begged and pleaded to be put onto the team. They put her on the team, cutting out valuable practice and travel time for the person who could have been there in her place. She decides that sitting out in the cold (which she knew would happen- as she's been to other opening ceremonies) hurt her especially considering she "never fully healed", then oops she pulled her groin again so she took herself out. I think her judgement was VERY selfish. If you aren't in peak physical form to compete don't go. Yes, I know that Dr.'s checked her out but YOU know your own body the best. She knew she might not be able to compete but yet she went. I'm sorry, but I have lost the little respect I had for her.
yeah, I know that comes off as harsh but I grew up wanting to be an olympic figure skater. I didn't get far in that quest but I know what goes into it and the whole Michelle Kwan thing frustrates me.
I don't know if my opinion is relevant but we have to remember that because of the different economics of our countries, our athletes have other concerns as well, like sponsoring, etc, while the athletes from China are sponsored by the state. That allows for them to dedicate most of their time with only 2 basic concerns: train and win.
I don't buy that "snowboard mentality" crap though. Shaun White, Danny Kass, & Seth Wescott epitomize freestyle riders yet they all did their best & got the gold and silvers. Shaun had more pressure on him than anyone, but he got it done in his last run. Danny Kass wasn't really expected to do well but he knows how to deal with the pressure and laid it down.
It's the primadonnas with all the ability but lack of toughness that are crumbling & choking.
I was just being sarcastic, guys -- I definitely think our Olympic athletes should give it everything they have and try to win. If not, then don't enter the trials in the first place and leave the slot for someone who will!
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I was just being sarcastic, guys -- I definitely think our Olympic athletes should give it everything they have and try to win. If not, then don't enter the trials in the first place and leave the slot for someone who will!
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Whew! Now it makes sense. You had me scared for a minute there, Dave.
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You guys are just mean. The important thing is that they made it to the Olympics, and they should just enjoy themselves while they are there. It's the experience and having fun that's important, not winning!
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I've always been more proud of our Olympians who finish dead last than the ones who actually win. Strange but true. What chaps my hide though is when we have an athlete who has won the event, she had the Gold medal wrapped up, and then LOST IT because she was dicking around at the finish line. What put it over the top was afterward, she basically shrugged her shoulders and gave us a half-hearted 'My bad.' That's not going to cut it with me. I doubt she really cares though.
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I didn't see it, I have no idea of what was going through her head but, just from what I know of some people, that's how they hide their real feelings. A public figure may not have that luxury - I wouldn't argue with that position - but I don't know what kind of "training" or instruction they get on how to conduct themselves when representing their country. I do know that's it's been a big issue in the past to I would assume they get something.
I am not trying to disagree with everyone else's sentements, and I am not sure if I can properly express what I am tyring to say in text; but I do somewhat sympathize with some of the athletes. It is ver hard to get inside their heads, understand what they are thinking, or realize their motivation from what little interaction we have with them through the TV. The pressures and circumstances are much more real and lasting for them, than us, the ones they are representing. Really in 3 months, who is going to remember how many gold medals the Americans brought home in the winter olympics? It is those athletes lives, however they convey it in their interviews or their performance. Our expectations and representation is thrust upon them. The ones that have rebelious attitudes are often their BECAUSE of that attitude, it is very hard to put that away for someone else, when it is the reason that you are there and has won you many a competition.
It can be hard to suddenly receive the attention and expectation of millions of people that you have no real interaction with. If the whole country decided to follow you to the gym or even to your job one day and expected your best performance, how would that go over? Would you drop your normal attitude or possible behavioral quirks and perform in a clean represenative way. What if you believe that it is your attitude that gives you the edge and makes you as good as you are - then you have a difficult decision. And remember, many of these athletes are very young.
This reminds me of a situation that was put on my brother when he was 18. He was a very good soccer player with as much potential as anyone. He could have had many choices of scholarships across the country, but decided to go to college at Arkansas, they didn't even have a soccer program(dropped because of Title 9). This was the end of his soccer career, at his choice. During some state athletic banquet where he was going to be honored he was made aware of what some others thought of his decision. His club coach just laid into him during a speach about how he was letting the community, the state, his teammates, and the future of soccer in Arkansas down. They thought that he owed it to those people to be an ambassador for soccer in the area as he displayed and further developed his talents in college and onward. This coach wasn't the only person who had this sentement, many people like to live the succeses of others that they can relate to. My brother simply wanted to move on the the next part of his life and enjoy college. He didn't understand anyone else concerning themselves with his life. Had he given into these types of pressures, it would be hard to blame him if he ever made a mistake, or didn't alwasys perform his best. Or if he didn't feel that he owed appology to anyone for the occasional lack of mental toughness.
I also remember a day, a Saturday, that me and a few friends were training volleyball on campus. There was a football game at noon that day, featuring superstar Michael Vick. As the hordes of lemings, mostly intheir number 7 shirts, began crossing campus to fill into the stadium, there was a very loud guy that hollared out to us. Questioning our mainly hood, informing us that it was our responsibility to support our football team, and other such nonsense. It is funny that I have never seen that guy at the varsity volleyball or soccer games. Really what he wanted was to live his life through the abilities of others. Our other varsity teams weren't as dominant, so his presence there didn't make much sense. He also felt the need to tell us that we needed to do the same as him, rather than spend our time training ourselves for our upcomming professional tournament. That night I didn't care that we lost the football game, or how many interceptions the "hero" threw. He tried his best, but was ripped appart by the fans that idolized him in the morning who thought that he should have performed better for them. I wonder what percent of those that called into the talk show to badmouth actually remember the game.
I know that my brother's story doesn't really parallel that of the olympic athletes', and my second story doesn't really mean anything, but it is hard to know the backgrounds, motivations, and true thoughts of the olympic athletes. Some are there because they want to win, some are there because they are goo and it is expected of them, some are there becaues they love the sport and were given the opportunity to go. I would imagine that it would be a difficult balance between competing how you normally would, and how the people want you to. If you win, the people don't care if you are yourself or not, if you loose, you had better be a perfect example of what they want. Problem is you might perform best as yourself, with your normal attitude. At those elete levels, it often is attitude and personality that makes the difference in 1st and 4th, they are all good athletes. Is a gold medal that much better than an entertaining and fun performance? If a skater were to do an awesome, fun, and spectacular performance, but it isn't exactly what the "judges" like, I would still be happy to see it. Conforming isn't always the BEST choice.
Those that choke, I feel bad for them. Most of them dedicate their lives to sport, then have a bad day. All we did is turn on the tv. I guarantee that the loss mean more to them than it does to you, regardless of how they respond in their post competition interview. The denial of caring is a very common mechanism, but it isn't an honest one. These are kids with the expectations of a nation on them. It can be a hard situation to handle properly every time.
I here ya Craig, and agree that we probably don't understand the pressure these men & women are under.
And I agree that winning isn't everything too. I'm most inspired by those that are plainly giving 110% but don't get the gold.
What I'm talking about in the first post are those athletes that have all the training advantages in the world, and put themselves out there (or at least their agents do) in the mediascape, but when it comes down to it falter because of a distinct lack of mental fortitude.
I was talking about this last week with my brother who races superbike. One of his teammates is a former star in Australia now racing in the US. In a discussion with another American racer the Aussie pointed out that if you go to race in Europe you better know that the best riders there will do whatever it takes and are mentally tough as nails.
I've heard the same said by ski racers.
Maybe Chris C can add his thoughts but I noticed something similar training martial arts in Japan. Even the kids had a good attitude & seemed to understand that tough training develops needed qualities. And I never saw parents pampering them either, telling them how special they are.
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You guys are just mean. The important thing is that they made it to the Olympics, and they should just enjoy themselves while they are there. It's the experience and having fun that's important, not winning!
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They're competing at the highest level of their sports. "Getting there" isn't what it's about imo. They're Olympic athletes representing the United States of America, not 10 year olds competing in a youth league.
edit: Haha... oops! Didn't catch the sarcasm. [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]
I thought Lindsay handled the post-fiasco interviews with grace and aplomb. She didn't whine, said that was the way things fell (pun intended) and that was that. I liked that - no big drama, no histrionics. As for the fall, sometimes the snow snakes just up and grab ya'. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
Same thing in a gold-medal winning interview with speed skater Shani Davis (fellow Chicagoan and trains in my hometown of EVANSTON, ILLINOIS!!!!). They asked him how great and historic it was that he was the first black man to win a gold medal at the Winter Games and his response was a one word answer like 'yeah' or something of that sort. Short, sweet, not wanting to bask in the limelight. I love that in an athlete.
Just my opinion..At the Olympic level, the top competitors have all done their training, they all have watched the nutrition, they have done everything they can to get to where they are. The only thing that separates them is then "Mental edge." Athletes that go up, and give thier all, and leave everything out on the playing field, ...the ones that bust their hump, drain thier bodies, for that extra tenth of a second, those are the Olympians I am proud to have represent my country.
Michelle Kwan, should have withdrawn weeks ago....but it may work in her replacements advantage...the woman has had no real media scrutiny, thus no added pressure.
Even appreciating the long-term commitment they've shown and the pressure they've been under, there is one additional element that seems sometimes lacking: obligation. They've put themselves in the ring to represent our country. But I get the sense that some of the athletes feel that they've gotten there on their own or that it's solely their own personal experience, and that aspects of their competition and performance is soley their choice and preference. They seem to have little sense of obligation to their country or others whom they represent; rather, they seem to express an attitude of "it's what I feel, and what I want." That, in my opinion, is spoiled and immature.
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I thought Lindsay handled the post-fiasco interviews with grace and aplomb. She didn't whine, said that was the way things fell (pun intended) and that was that. I liked that - no big drama, no histrionics. As for the fall, sometimes the snow snakes just up and grab ya'. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
Same thing in a gold-medal winning interview with speed skater Shani Davis (fellow Chicagoan and trains in my hometown of EVANSTON, ILLINOIS!!!!). They asked him how great and historic it was that he was the first black man to win a gold medal at the Winter Games and his response was a one word answer like 'yeah' or something of that sort. Short, sweet, not wanting to bask in the limelight. I love that in an athlete.
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I saw the Shani Davis interview with Mellisa Starks and thought the exact opposite. I thought he was a total jackass. I didn't find his interview short and sweet I found it terse and angry filled with one word answers. I swear Starks rolled her eyes at the end. He showed no class at winning, and completely lacked any sense of team. The interview with his mother probably had something to do with it. She came accross as a showbiz mom living off the talent of her son. Interesting 2 different interpretations of the same event but unless some facts change I chalk him up to another athlete with more talent than brains.
I don't know how I missed this thread.
Kuri, many of the points you make are just what I was feeling as I watched the competition. Our athletes are made into de facto superstars before they get to the games, while other countries are keeping their eyes on the prize.
Mental Toughness
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