I just started NROLFW after doing some IF and PSMF and taking a break from working out for a few months. I lost about 8 lb.-- half way to my goal. Then I took a diet break, did a little cardio and a little lifting for a couple weeks. I am 40 (dear God), 5'2" and currently around 123 lb. Dunno BF, but somewhere between 23% and 32% according to Tanita (yeah, right).
I just started NROLFW a week ago. Like so many others here, I am nervous about eating as much as the authors recommend. I did P90X last fall and wound up gaining around 5-7 lb. on the diet they recommended, and I don't think much of it was LBM. I decided to eat at 300 cal. under NROLFW recommended maintenance levels for now and see how it goes. So far, my weight has not changed.
I lifted today. I was supposed to eat at least 1617 calories for the day. I did, but the last meal was one I wasn't dying to eat. It feels so strange not to be starving all the time! I like it, but on the other hand, it sort of scares me that I am going to start gaining fat like crazy.
I'm gonna try to tough it out mentally and hope for the best! Dieting sucks so bad that I don't want to have to go back to starving if I gain on this new regime. I don't really know how I can tell if any weight I gain is fat or LBM. My Tanita scale varies wildly- about 8+% on any given day, and I must suck at using calipers because I always get different readings. I am getting hydrostatic BF testing this weekend. I hope it's more accurate than Tanita.
I guess I am just looking for a pep talk from anyone who has had success with NROLFW. How do you know when you need to drop calories? I don't feel comfortable waiting until I have gained five pounds since it will take me over a month of dieting to get rid of it. Thanks everyone!
I'd suggest that you weigh yourself with the same frequency that you have in the past, and don't wait until you've gained 5 pounds to adjust calories.
Seriously though, you're eating 300 cals less than recommended and after a week your weight hasn't changed. So I wouldn't worry about it for the moment. The only thing that I'd caution is don't make your weigh-in day (if it's once a week) a day after you've done your workout. It's not unusual to retain a bit of water after a rough workout. The other suggestion would be to keep your water intake consistent. It's another thing that can mess with your weight and not be real gain or loss. With such a wide variation in your Tanita scale, it could be hydration playing into that. If you level out your water intake you may find it's more helpful. Although to be fair the only thing I've ever found bodyfat scales for is long-term trending (ie. like a 30-day average compared to another 30-day average).
I guess I am just looking for a pep talk from anyone who has had success with NROLFW. How do you know when you need to drop calories? I don't feel comfortable waiting until I have gained five pounds since it will take me over a month of dieting to get rid of it. Thanks everyone!
Here's how I look at it. I may be wrong, I have been before, but I honestly can not continue to war with my body the way I have been since puberty.
Pay attention to your body. Trust what it tells you.
How screwed up are we, to be afraid of *not* feeling hungry? How much hell have we put ourselves through that we fear the repercussions of changing our diets?
I sympathize with you. I'm dismayed and discouraged to have gained back 30 lbs of the 50lbs I starved off of myself four years ago. Thing is, long term starving really screwed up my metabolism. I started feeling sick all the time.
To top that off, I'm hypoglycemic, so *not* eating has nasty repercussions for me too. I have far to much over my diet. It should not be this hard... *sigh*
What I am personally hoping for with NROL4W is a way to maintain my body in a healthy, long term way. I want to be able to lift heavy things and *feel* healthy most of the time.
Taking a step in a new direction always requires a leap of faith too. All we can do is our best, eh?
Maybe you would feel better about it if you tracked your measurements. That way when you start putting on muscle in the right places, you'll know it's muscle and not fat. You'll have a better handle on *how* your body is changing.
BTW, my weight varies by a full 5 lbs every month anyway, depending on where I am in my cycle. That might be a good thing to keep in mind. if you notice an upwards blip.
Good points! I do find it frustrating to track how I am doing. After losing 8 lb. recently, my measurements changed only a tiny bit. Clothes definitely fit better, though. I have been taking photos and can see some positive changes there. It's just NOT that dramatic and it takes many weeks for me to be able to SEE a change.
You know how you look at "before and after" photos where you say, "Wow!" That's not me . More like, "Well, maybe a bit less pudge on the belly and thighs." I'm glad I don't have a lot of fat to lose, but I still look super flabby in a bikini! I wish I had a more objective measuring device that could detect small changes. My body image is so unreliable. At times I look in the mirror and see positive changes. Other times, I feel I have made no progress at all. And that's in the same week!
All of this is a bummer. I hate that so many of us (women) go through this. I know that achieving whatever "look" is really not the answer. I want to achieve a healthier body composition first and foremost. I think I need to work on my perception, though.
Good points! I do find it frustrating to track how I am doing.... I think I need to work on my perception, though.
In that case, perhaps you can focus on the improvements you're making with your lifting. At least that's something tangible that steadily and measurably improves the longer you stick to the workout plans. If you're having a bad day you can look at your chart from three weeks ago and remember how you struggled to life 5 lbs less than you can easily lift now.
And forget the bikini - find youself a good nudie beach! Nothing makes you love your body more than laying out in the sand with dozens of other people in their birthday suits, all different ages, weights and levels of fitness. Nudie beaches are very "Come as you are and be proud of it!"
As to the bikini, I haven't worn one in public for at least 15 years and not planning to any time soon. I did, however, buy one yesterday to take my "physique" photos which are really for my eyes only . Let me tell ya, there's still a lotta goo hangin' over the bikini bottoms! It's funny because in the past, I was pretty thrilled to reach my current weight. Now I want more muscle and less fat, not just a number on the scale. Is that a positive thing? I think it is.
Now I want more muscle and less fat, not just a number on the scale. Is that a positive thing? I think it is.
Hell yeah it is. Hamster high-five!
I'm going to take my "before" pics this weekend... Not that I'm feeling all that photogenic right now, but I'll be glad I did in six months just to see how far I've come.
I've found that when I try too hard to count and make sure I'm getting enough protein and enough calories according to my weight and make sure I'm eating enough times a day, I always end up gaining weight. I once read a book that made so much sense. Like you've both mentioned in your posts, basically, listen to your body. If you're hungry, eat. When you're not hungry anymore, stop eating. If you're craving a certain food, it probably means that your body needs some nutrient in that food. Eat it - or a healthy alternative to it. The key is to not eat when you're not hungry, such as mindless munching out of boredom or stress.
The advise in this book is great when you need something to use as guidelines to what makes your body healthy. And it also mentions several times to adjust it based on what YOUR body needs.
I'm 40 yrs old too. (40 is FAB!) 5'3" and right now weigh about 125. I'm most comfortable at 115. When I started this workout I weight 123. That was almost 2 months ago. Bottom line, I've eaten too many calories. I love the workout, but I'm adjusting the diet to what my body is used to and what I feel like it needs.
Thanks for bringing this topic up. It's something I struggle with myself.
I've found that when I try too hard to count and make sure I'm getting enough protein and enough calories according to my weight and make sure I'm eating enough times a day, I always end up gaining weight. I once read a book that made so much sense. Like you've both mentioned in your posts, basically, listen to your body. If you're hungry, eat. When you're not hungry anymore, stop eating. If you're craving a certain food, it probably means that your body needs some nutrient in that food. Eat it - or a healthy alternative to it. The key is to not eat when you're not hungry, such as mindless munching out of boredom or stress.
The advise in this book is great when you need something to use as guidelines to what makes your body healthy. And it also mentions several times to adjust it based on what YOUR body needs.
I'm 40 yrs old too. (40 is FAB!) 5'3" and right now weigh about 125. I'm most comfortable at 115. When I started this workout I weight 123. That was almost 2 months ago. Bottom line, I've eaten too many calories. I love the workout, but I'm adjusting the diet to what my body is used to and what I feel like it needs.
Thanks for bringing this topic up. It's something I struggle with myself.
Interesting how different people are. I have learned through unfortunate trial and error that I can't trust my body because I just rarely feel full or ready to stop eating. If I listen to my hunger, I gain. A lot. I do much better weighing everything... I don't make sure I eat enough times/day though - my hunger takes care of that, but if I try for 6 meals or whatever, it's very hard to NOT overeat! I'd love to eat intuitively one day, but I'm not sure I ever will if I don't want to regain all the weight I've lost.
I have learned through unfortunate trial and error that I can't trust my body because I just rarely feel full or ready to stop eating. If I listen to my hunger, I gain. A lot.
I can relate to this! I do feel that the "hunger" I feel is at least partly psychological, though. I have found that the last week or so, I am not very hungry for my last meal of the day. I get a lot hungrier when I am eating delicious stuff like homemade strawberry ice cream, Tennessee BBQ, Bucheron cheese, hefeweizen and CA pinot noir than when I am eating chicken breast and vegetables.
Maybe it's the sugar that's addicting or maybe it's just that the healthy option doesn't make my inner toddler do backflips for joy. I used to think I could out-exercise my hedonistic tendencies. Being a foodie on a restrictive diet is a buzz kill for everyone, but I don't want to be squishy either.
What are your goals i.e. are you looking to lose fat or just trying to maintain your weight and get stronger/build muscle?
I have basically the same stats as you --40, 5'2, and 121-122 lbs. Last year I did NROLW following the calorie recommendations in the book and gained. I cut the cals by 300 as they recommended and stop gaining but only lost 2 lbs over 6 months. My goal at the time was to lose about 7 lbs. My clothes did fit better so I clearly lost inches but nothing dramatic. I cut calories more but didn't have the energy for the workouts. I am getting much better weight loss results wiht a bigger deficit and less intense workouts. When I am at my goal I will go back to NROLW to work on body recomposition.
What are your goals i.e. are you looking to lose fat or just trying to maintain your weight and get stronger/build muscle?
I guess my goal is more toward building muscle right now. I dieted for about 8 weeks. I was going to keep going until I reached a reasonable BF level then start a lifting program. However, psychologically I needed a break and was eager to try NROLFW.
I wonder if I could do part of the program (i.e. phase 1) then diet for a couple weeks, then move to phase 2? Maybe I would be too weak to start back on phase 2. I really don't want to wait 6 months before I try to lose some more fat!
By the way, thanks everyone for all the helpful insight. I can't tell you how much your support helps me. I read a lot of posts on this web site and it is really inspiration to read about other people's experiences.
Oh! I forgot to say that my BF was 25.7% according to the dunking system today. That's about 2% higher than the Tanita said right before I had it done. Realcdn is right on about hydration level having a big effect on Tanita numbers. I am getting the most accurate numbers when I check in the early evening when I get home from work, between lunch and dinner.
LaraT-- that's what I am doing currently. I used the extreme diets out of desperation and knew it would only be short-term. It was not fun, but it did work.
well the dieting methods you used were pretty extreme. Why not try something more reasonable and sustainable if you want to lose more fat?
I'm looking into something that's higher in protein, with moderate fat and carbohydrates, and no refined sugar or flour. That last part is the kicker for me.
I did extreme dieting too, years ago - 900 calories a day. But it's not something you can reasonably maintain over many years. I felt like such crap after two years. I was obliged to eat more carbs, which triggered sugar cravings, which I obliged, which started the weight gain cycle all over again.
I'm thinking there must be some way to meet the body's protein requirements while lifting, and simultaneously encourage the body to get it's energy from sugar stored in the body as fat, instead of from what's eaten.
I understand the temptation to want to just *fix it*, but starving is never going to be a long term solution.
To the folks who find they can't trust their bodies - I can relate. I remember sugar cravings so bad that I would have dreams about cake, cookies, donuts etc. I don't think that's the body talking so much as the addiction to sugar.
On the flip side, sometimes I *have* to eat when I'm not hungry, or my blood sugar will crash. If I eat the wrong thing (like plain rice with no protein) I'll make it worse. We can really war with our bodies our entire lives, and it's exhausting.
I think that cultivating different eating habits and working out should be about making peace with our bodies, and you can't have peace talks without learning what your body's saying.
A lot of things can be called "hunger". For me, sugar cravings are totally different than hunger, and it's not just about wanting ice cream. It's a siren announcing the imminent drop of blood sugar, and I'd better pay attention. Honestly, I very rarely get actually hungry, I usually get other signals far before hunger.
Muscle weakness means I need to eat a banana. Menstrual cramps means eat salmon if I can get it. Headaches can mean drink more water, or have some rice, or a baked potato.
So maybe your "hunger" isn't for calories, but for some specific chemical reinforcement your body needs. If you can translate those messages, (and see through the junk-food cravings) then you can target your eating to specifically meet the need and avoid over-eating.
That's my theory anyway. It involves a lot of food journals.
BTW, my weight varies by a full 5 lbs every month anyway, depending on where I am in my cycle. That might be a good thing to keep in mind. if you notice an upwards blip.
My weight fluctuates terribly - my scale was up 7 pounds this morning from Friday! Granted, I went away for the weekend and indulged in lots of bad carb foods when I typically eat clean.
I agree that this whole health thing is more about getting to know your body and its rhythms then having a specific weight in mind. The only way that I am not upset by my 7 pound gain is because I kept track of my weight every day for several months and learned how certain foods and activities effect my weight. Because I kept track, I know that in 3 days, I'll be back to normal. A few years ago, I would have been so upset by this gain that I would have completely given up my healthy habits because it obviously wasn't worth it.
I read somewhere once (and come across it every now and then) that you have to make goals out of behaviors because you can't control outcomes. So while I might want to lose 5 pounds, I can't make that happen just because I want to. Instead, I have to behave in healthy ways. My goal needs to be, "I will plan out three clean meals and two clean snacks everyday for the next week", instead of, "I will lose two pounds this week".
For the record, my weight gain makes me feel like I should eat nothing but iceberg lettuce for the next week even though I'm craving chocolate chip cookies! I just keep telling myself it will pass and I will feel better. White sugar is pure evil and does horrible things to the psyche!
I have found that upping my protein and good fats helps a lot with feeling satisfied and reducing cravings. Eating clean, whole, non-processed foods makes me feel so much better mentally and physically it makes it easier to stay on track. I do have a big sweet tooth and believe everything in moderation is the way to go. I plan to have a sweet treat or two each week. But instead of buying a carton of ice cream I go out and order one scoop or buy one cookie etc and don't keep that stuff at home. When I forbid the foods I love (sweets, breads) it just makes cravings worse and I can wind up bingeing on them. Not eating enough also can make me prone to binges so I won't do anything really extreme like IF/PSMF. Recipe for disaster for me.
I think NROLW is a great program but for me, there was no way I could do it at a calorie level that was conducive to fat loss. I would rather really target fat loss and lift to maintain muscle using a less intense program and be done with the fat loss part. Then go to something like New Rules to increase muscle, strength, body recomp etc.
Satiety is strange.
. More like, "Well, maybe a bit less pudge on the belly and thighs." I'm glad I don't have a lot of fat to lose, but I still look super flabby in a bikini! I wish I had a more objective measuring device that could detect small changes. My body image is so unreliable. At times I look in the mirror and see positive changes. Other times, I feel I have made no progress at all. And that's in the same week! 
. Let me tell ya, there's still a lotta goo hangin' over the bikini bottoms! It's funny because in the past, I was pretty thrilled to reach my current weight. Now I want more muscle and less fat, not just a number on the scale. Is that a positive thing? I think it is.
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