Could time off help?

[alessa]

I just finished stage 4. While I can lift more than when I started and am presumably stronger,I have not lost bf, and my clothes are not fitting better, worse if anything. So I do not feel great. While my eating is not perfect, I do not binge. I have not had a holiday pigout or anything since I started (or in many years for that matter). My downfall is more like having a protein bar each day or sf/ff fro yo, in other words, I do not always eat clean all day long. That said, I do eat tons of green veggies daily and my meals are veggies and fish or lean protein. My daily calories have been around 1700-1800 for a few months. Initially I was a little higher but brought it down since I wasn't getting results. I never have one of those pigout days that I used to get away with when I was much younger. I know I couldn't deal with the repercussions, but like I said I do have something w/ artificial sweetner at least once/day. Though it may not be great for getting the perfect body, I don't see where it should be such a major impediment to any bf loss whatsoever. I have also increased cardio over the last month so now in addition to walking for transportation about 90 minutes daily (slow city walking), I am doing intervals 2-3x/wk and ss 1x/wk. In the past I was able to maintain with only ss. It may sound like a lot of cardio but doing less was not working.

I am wondering about a couple of possibilities: my body does not do well with intervals (contrary to everyone else) OR is just having its own little rebellion. I am supposed to go away for a week to visit in-laws and am wondering if my body just needs a workout break. I have not gone a week without working out for as long as I can remember. Even after both kids, I was back at the gym within 5 days. I don't know if I will even be able to do it, but I am at a loss as to why I am not losing any fat. I used to eat fro yo every single night and was 2 sizes smaller (just last year and prior to that, not so long ago). I am eating with more discipline than I ever have and normally this would give me quick results, so I do not know what is going on with my body. I hesitate to go much lower with calories bc I dread the regain that would probably result.

Any thoughts on taking a week off? While I had my thyroid tested and it was normal, I still feel like my metabolism must be at rock bottom for me. Sorry for rambling post, didn't mean it to get so long!

[frogguruami]

I don't know if it will help with fat loss but if you have gone all the way to stage 4 without a break then you need one!!!!! I know one is recommended after stage 1 and I think after stage 3 also.

[missjane]

Since diet is key -- upwards of 90% by some estimates, I'm thinking you need to key in on something diet-wise here. What are your macros? Maybe you are taking in too many carbs? Can you post a sample day of eats?

[alessa]

this is a somewhat typical day -

3 egg white omelette with broccoli/spinach
slice organic ham
sliced tomato
1/2 piece sprouted bread or 1/2 c chickpeas
1 tsp some kind of oil or a few nuts
decaf w/ little whole milk

salad - lettuce, cukes, celery, tomato, shredded carrots
grilled chix or fish or if not available, organic beef jerky - 2-3 oz.
1/2 tbl caesar or 1 tbl. lite caesar dressing (40 calories, 4 f, 1 c)

protein bar (pure protein 280 cal, 30 p, 8 f, 27 total c incl 3 fiber, 11 sugar alc or atkins 220 cal 17p, 9f, 27 total c incl 11 fiber, 4 sugar alcohol)
80 g sf/ff alpha-1 fro yo (80 cal, 16 c, 4 p)

iced decaf w/ little milk

salad - tons of lettuce, 1 or 2 plum tomato
steamed zucchini - 3
3-4 oz. tilapia grilled
diet coke
decaf skim cappuccino

shake - 2 scoop pp
1 c. 1% or skim milk or ff plain yogurt
ice, water
2 pk diet hot cocoa or sf/ff pudding
1 t. fish oil
splenda

My w/o is either first thing in the morning (in which case I just eat a slice of turkey or ham to avoid low blood sugar, don't do well exercising on carbs first thing) or about an hour after lunch.

Thanks!

[LaraT]

are you weighing/measuring your food and tracking calories/macros in some type of program or guesstimating?

Also, does the fro yo come from a store or are you dishing it out at home? Oftentimes in the fro-yo shops you get double what they say the serving size is (so double the cals)

[alessa]

Lara, You are so right about the fro yo store. It is from a store, but I weigh it occasionally at home so that I can eye it in the future. The first time I was shocked that 40 g, the size on which the cals are based, was tiny. But, now I can eyeball pretty well.

In terms of the rest of it, I am not tracking daily but occasionally put it into fit day to stay in the right ballpark. So, it can certainly vary a little. I used to be obsessed with counting calories, and it took a few years to get away from that. However, I can see where it would probably help again at this point.

[kfisherx]

One of two things happening

1. Either you are eating more than you think. This happens to people who do not weigh their food.

Or....

2. You are under eating forever and your metabolism tanked. I used to think this was almost impossible to do but when I came to this board I was eating 1400 kcals a day and was super active. Now I burn up 2370 kcals a day and the number keeps growing.

So are you measuring/weighing food? When troubleshooting this sort of thing it is essential to undestand details.

[alessa]

Wow, kfisherx, I cannot believe you were eating 1400 and can now eat 2370! I am quite active. Although I am not weight training more than nrol4w, I have 2 little kids and as I mentioned, walk constantly on top of gym time.

I weigh protein sources (bc they come in packages with weight on it) and measure dairy. I do not measure any vegetables, but I would measure something like chickpeas since it's denser calorically than veggies. I do not track it regularly on fitday but do once in a while. I will use fitday for a few days again. I could be 100 or 200 calories underestimating which, as you mention, could be a culprit here. Although again, what's strange and why I question whether it's just that is that I was eating more than this (and not tracking) for years and weighed less and was smaller until this year. I have only cut out food since then after the initial gain which happened quite quickly after I weaned my son.

Thanks!

[rixatrix]

Originally Posted by alessa

Although again, what's strange and why I question whether it's just that is that I was eating more than this (and not tracking) for years and weighed less and was smaller until this year. I have only cut out food since then after the initial gain which happened quite quickly after I weaned my son.

Forgive my dude, but DUDE...I second what Karla said. Eating too little can really shut down the fat loss, especially in women. A lot of fitness experts completely agree that women have "thrifty genes." (I think those are the ones that come up to your ribs and have tapered, acid-washed legs...)

Your metabolism isn't a set point. John Berardi has a really interesting idea about energy expenditure and intake. And Skwigg has some thoughts, too.

It might help if we knew how much you weigh/bf%/age, etc., to help you figure out calories. But man, you're doing a LOT of work. Two kids, and hour and a half of walking each day, plus (I'm going to guess here) 6-7 days of intervals/ss/weights a week?

Are you also tired? A little cranky? Hungry? Eat, eat, eat!

I totally agree about tracking calories, and here's why. It's an equation. You can GUESS how many calories you need, but until you start keeping good data, you won't really know.

Let's say my maintenance is 2400 calories/day. I guess it to be 2200 calories a day, plus I take a bit off the top because I want to lose weight. 2200 - 500 = 1700. And maybe I throw in some extra exercise, pushing my maintenance to 2600-2700 calories a day. Suddenly I've cut 1000 calories/day without even knowing it, and my body stalls out.

If I'm keeping good track, and I decide to add some calories back in, I'll know what my body is doing. If I start to lose weight when I increase my food, I'll know that I was undereating. Even if I eat more, and don't GAIN any weight, I'll know that my maintenance is still somewhere off in the distance.

Common advice is to increase calories by 200-300 cals/day each week until you find your sweet spot. You might gain water at first, but ignore it. You'll probably freak out because you've gained water - ignore that too.

You lose weight in a deficit. If your metabolism has adjusted down, your deficit isn't as big. Bring your metabolism back up, and you create a bigger gap. Does that make sense?

[kfisherx]

Originally Posted by alessa

Wow, kfisherx, I cannot believe you were eating 1400 and can now eat 2370! I am quite active. Although I am not weight training more than nrol4w, I have 2 little kids and as I mentioned, walk constantly on top of gym time.

Well I was still loosing a bit of weight at 1400 cals but it was so small (like .5 lbs a month) So my maintain was probably slightly higer. Even so I am eating 2800 a month now and only adding .6 lbs a week (I am bulking right now) so burning is happening at about 2370 a day. I was shocked as heck when I started to eat how my metabolism started to crank up with my cal intake. It was cool.

I don't know if this applies to you too but it is definately a possibility.

[alessa]

Thanks for the articles. I was able to access the first article which was very interesting. I am 5'3" and 122. I kind of lost trust in the available methods, i.e. callipers., but last time bf was 20%. I am not so set on losing a number of pounds, but of course I would like to lower my bf which will likely result in that (especially if we believe one cannot reduce bf while gaining muscle). While I was nursing, I was eating about five hundred cals more than now but like now working out and walking regularly. So I am speculating that that had an impact on my metabolism. During that time, I was around 115 and probably had lost a little muscle. I cut back on my cals since I had weaned and was gaining weight.

I did have a thyroid test, and the tsh was well within normal although the other numbers were on the low side (but within range). My internist said that if tsh was normal, then my thyroid was normal.

I put my food into fitday yesterday (a no w/o but walking 90 minutes day), and it was 1600 cals, 43%p, 35%c, 22%f. It was probably a little less food than a w/o day but not that much less.