The "F" word and weight lifting - Feminism

[rixatrix]

Lou links to this article from his blog today:

Push-ups giving women a bad rep

It's all about women doing push-ups and one writer's response to people who reacted badly to this piece from the New York Times.


I especially like where she takes it at the end of the article:

Of course there's something more insidious going on here.
Women don't do push ups because they think of them as a man exercise. Same goes for weightlifting. We teach women to strive for thin and toned, but not strong and powerful. I mean, be athletic, but not so athletic that you can kick a guy's rear end at strength endeavors.

I think a lot of women here might be able to relate. Growing up a child of the 80s, the message I got was always "You can be anything you want to be," which may have literally translated in my little brain as, "Boys aren't better than you just because they're boys. You can be just as good at anything they're good at." Which is probably why I love lifting - why SHOULDN'T I be strong? Why shouldn't I be able to haul my groceries without help and move a solid oak hutch if I need to?

But I realize the message may have been different for a lot of women growing up.

So I'm wondering - How did all of you get into strength training? Does it go against what you were taught when you were younger, or were you always athletic and strong? Why do you think some women still feel like it's not their place to be strong?

And how do you feel now, with regards to push-ups? (Thanks, Alwyn!)

[PowerManDL]

I'd say because in most cases the majority of cultural/social gender roles are still heavily influenced by biological and evolutionary (sexual selection) factors.

Until that changes, I doubt you'll see any over-arching changes in how the average person understands how "men" and "women" behave.

[missjane]

Great article! I'm going to send it to my team at work doing our corporate Wellness Challenge.

[Karen P]

Hey, I really like your post. My need to be strong and fit just comes from my need to be self-sufficient. I can't stand depending on anybody for anything. As a child, I was always encouraged to be strong. I grew up on a farm and so a lot of my everyday activities involved a little muscle. I also have 2 bothers, so I was always sort of trying to hang with them. I have a younger sister who is super strong, and it just comes naturally to her. She doesn't lift weights or strength train, but she works with horses and that requires a lot of muscle. However, we also felt the pressure to be "girlie." For me, it's just extremely important to be able to do evrything I want to do without having to ask for help. If I need to move the iron coffee table to vaccuum under it, then I'll move it and if I need to carry my rediculously heavy suit case, I'll carry it. Strength training is just a way of keeping and perfecting that strenth that I really get from everyday activities. I only want to be as strong as I need to be, I guess. Anyway, I just wanted to comment. Take care!

[jzomom]

I was told by my Dad that I was not an athlete, playing on my first little league team, stuck in right field. Last game he was not able to coach and the assistant put me at second base and I fielded everything that came to me, even turning a double play. When the assistant told him what happened he said, "Yeah right, what really happened?" right in front of me.

At that moment I determined to be the best at everything I did. Especially sports. I may not have been the most gifted, but I worked harder than anyone else and was harder on myself than anyone could be. I was known as being the best, even when playing on boys baseball teams. My first serious boyfriend admitted he used to hate me because I always threw him out when we played against eachother. My dad has never seen me play to this day, not even when I played for my college team.

So I definitely used to feel that bias. Gratefully my dh loves that I am an athlete, especially because I get him on all our teams, we are a package deal.

[realcdn]

Originally Posted by rixatrix

But I realize the message may have been different for a lot of women growing up.

So I'm wondering - How did all of you get into strength training? Does it go against what you were taught when you were younger, or were you always athletic and strong? Why do you think some women still feel like it's not their place to be strong?

I was never athletic, although I've always been stronger than most of the women I know. My last job was in an automotive manufacturer of driveshafts for pick-ups and heavy duty trucks. Although my general fitness level wasn't as good as it is right now, there were days I picked up and moved quite heavy components. After I'm done with my (upcoming) education I plan to go back to the manufacturing sector. I do plan to be stronger (even though I may not need to be).

I was a child in the 70s, growing up with messages about what little girls should do. It's a good thing that my parents didn't buy into that, and specifically made sure I understood that I could do anything I chose to do. Of course, it's kind of sad that my father didn't live long enough to see me heading back to school (with an eventual track that will make me the Engineer he always wanted me to be).

[Cynthia]

Doing military-style pushups has ALWAYS been a goal for me. I didn't make it a priority until I picked up NROL4W though. I was very athletic as a teen, in fact, I lifted weights twice a day during track season (not knowing the harm) until my coach found out and bawled me out. I got back into lifting a few years ago and didn't really start the pushup goal until January. I went from girlie knee pushups 3 months ago to 60 military-style pushups on Monday (4x15).

I am not sure why women have this stupid idea that they will get bulky or big if they lift weights. I can't count the number of people (all female) I've corrected on that misnomer in just the past few months, one of them was my MOM.

Lifting weights gives me a much bigger sense of accomplishment than any form of cardio I've found (except walking the dog, haha). I think every woman should strive to be able to do a few sets of pushups!

[Emoore]

"when I pick up a barbell for overhead presses, I will get strange looks from some of those guys. Very few will offer to spot my bench press"


Where do these women work out? Cro-magnon-land? The middle ages? When I worked out at Gold's, I never got strange looks for doing bench presses, overhead presses, squats, deadlifts, or anything else. And nobody ever offered to spot anyone that I saw, but when I turned to a random guy and said, "hey, can you spot me on this," he was always more than happy to oblige.

As I ponder this more, I think it may have something to do with the way a woman subconsciously carries herself. From an early age my dad taught me that 1)I can do anything a man can do except father children and stand up to pee, and 2) If you act like you know what you're doing, generally no one will question you. Now that I'm an adult, I do a lot of traditional male stuff like weightlifting, motorcycling, and shooting, and have NEVER been treated like I am somehow inferior.

[foodfromafar]

Originally Posted by rixatrix

So I'm wondering - How did all of you get into strength training? Does it go against what you were taught when you were younger, or were you always athletic and strong? Why do you think some women still feel like it's not their place to be strong?

And how do you feel now, with regards to push-ups? (Thanks, Alwyn!)

I began seriously considering strength training after reading a book called Strong Women Stay Slim in which the author explains the connection between strength training and stronger bones as we age.

My dad taught all of us (daughters or sons) that we could do or be anything we wanted. I have always been petite and never considered myself athletic though I have always enjoyed hiking and camping.

I think it takes a lot of work for women to gain upper body strength and that's why push ups and pull ups aren't a big draw. Who wants to do something that is so difficult and takes so much work to even begin?

Now, I see strength training as part of my regimen to aid the aging process. I want strong bones! I'm only in Stage 1 of NROLFW, but I'm finding that I love the challenges presented each workout.

BTW, everyone has been nothing but kind and courteous to me. Sometimes I feel a little funny in the "big boy" section as one trainer referred to the free weights area because I look like one of the 7 dwarves - Dopey maybe? HAH! But I don't care and everyone is pleasant. I have wondered if someone would be willing to spot me at some point. I haven't figured the dynamics of that out yet.

[Bytsi]

I was never athletic as a kid - I wasn't fat (not til college) but I was always the one walking in at the end of a run in gym class, never picked for teams, etc etc. I tried working out a few times (yeah, I did have a leotard and leg warmers!) but it never stuck. And I was fat for my entire 20's.

When I started losing weight, I went to WW meetings. I bought a treadmill soon after... and started to tire of hearing the people at the WW meeting scheme for ways to stretch their points, to eat more for less points with little math tricks... The more I walked, the better I felt. Then I started to run. Kickboxing just happened to be the "hot" new trend, so I went to a class and hit something (a bag) for the first time in my life. Love at first punch!!!

We did pushups in kickboxing, so maybe that's where it started? Once I transitioned into martial arts, pushups were always required. And then I read how weights would help me lose more weight and reshape my body. I started doing bicep curls and tricep kickbacks only (wow, what a workout!), but I started reading more and more... found Oxygen magazine, then "Body Building Bible for Women" - changed EVERYTHING!!! I learned to LIFT. By the time I went back to school and made fitness my career, I had pretty strong opinions about women dropping the helpless routine and being STRONG.

So... while I was never explicitly taught NOT to be strong, I was never really pushed or encouraged to be physically strong either. I was strong in some ways in my teens because I rode horses and did tons of manure shoveling and water-bucket hauling to support my habit... but the lifting I do now, the desire for strength and muscles - I came to it gradually. I LOVE that I can out-pushup many guys - and on my knuckles too, if necessary . I love kicking guy's butts at karate (although they kick mine right back!), and I can't wait to do tons of pullups too! I love the look of muscles, not emaciated scrawny Hollywood women.

Sorry I rambled on there

[chickdiver]

I was always athletic, but in an offbeat kind of way- the potential was always there, but I never cared for team sports. I swam competitively some as a kid, and I really hit my stride as a young adult when I learned to SCUBA dive. The deeper I got into diving, the better I became, and the more I leaned towards "technical" diving- which, in the early 90's when I started, was very male dominated. Not only was I a female in a male dominated activity (and industry, as I became an instructor), I was a YOUNG FEMALE. I got involved in my mid 20's with an elite group of cave explorers- and I eventually became the only female mixed gas diver out of a team of 100+ divers. Less than 10 of us were women. I gained the guys respect, partly, because I never whined about things and pulled my share of the work. I got into lifting because I had to move heavy equipment around- equipment that weighed nearly what I did out of the water (in the water is easy). I also had to get myself and my equipment back on boats- sometimes in very ugly conditions- having the strength and stamina to do so was a matter of safety. These days, I am a respected technical diver and technical diving instructor.

My parents never told me I wasn't capable of doing anything I wanted to do. My Dad has always been awesomely supportive. My male dive buddies are awesome, they have been known to set others (mostly boat captains) straight when they have questioned my ability to do a particular dive.

[Juleslynne]

Interesting stories!

I have a picture of me (about age 8) standing beside my brother, wearing a pink t-shirt with the words "Anything boys can do, girls can do better" on it. I love that photo....

I started strength training in high-school to build muscle because I was a competitive rider (equestrian). Now, I strength train because I love it. I love feeling strong and looking strong. Oh...and it's something I can share with my husband.....our workouts in the gym.

I think there's so much information out there about how to get fit and strong, too much maybe that people get side-tracked and confused.

If I counted all of the 'strong women' images I see in a day, from TV ads,shows, magazines, billboards, or just from looking at people walking down the street.....I'd still be trying to get to the number 5. Why do so many women believe it's not their place to be strong? Because they don't see it often enough.

In regards to push-ups....bring them on!!!

[Aoife]

Originally Posted by Emoore

From an early age my dad taught me that 1)I can do anything a man can do except father children and stand up to pee,

Search online. There's guides to teach ya how to pee standing up. Why let the boys have all the fun?

[PowerManDL]

Feminism: Because having something to prove is way more important than common sense!

[LisaC]

Originally Posted by jzomom

I was told by my Dad that I was not an athlete, playing on my first little league team, stuck in right field. Last game he was not able to coach and the assistant put me at second base and I fielded everything that came to me, even turning a double play. When the assistant told him what happened he said, "Yeah right, what really happened?" right in front of me.

My dad has never seen me play to this day, not even when I played for my college team.

Whoa - your story is intense...

Originally Posted by Emoore

From an early age my dad taught me that 1)I can do anything a man can do except father children and stand up to pee, and 2) If you act like you know what you're doing, generally no one will question you.

Very funny! When I was a kid in 1978, my mom and I were walking to some girl scout thing and I was wearing a belt that read, "Girls' Lib". When I asked her what it meant, she replied with #1 above!

My dad taught me that no one will question you if you're carrying a clipboard! So guess what velogirl and I bring to the gym!


Besides all this, I grew up on the athletic side, though I never was exceptionally strong and hated being referred to as a jock. Already feeling generally vulnerable in life for my androgynous appearance which continues to alarm and threaten women in public restrooms, I have never pursued anything that could be construed as an exclusively masculine activity.

That being said, my three years on a farm taught me a LOT about how strength is not just about muscle, but about leverage and creative solutions for heavy lifting - an excellent introduction to compound movements and body mechanics to say the least.

Thankfully, I'm moving beyond these self-inflicted restrictions... I think life is getting easier for athletic girls in general, and I'm finding a ton of support in martial arts training, cycling, and strength training in general.

[Aoife]

I've never in my life thought or felt that I was somehow inferior to anyone, male or female. I was the second best in grade school at the general physical fitness work we had to do for the monthly tests (presidential physical fitness stuff in the early 80s). The best in the class was another girl. I've always been able to do pushups, (which sucks now because after a sucky shoulder blowout after pushing for like 100 a day for a few days in a row I have issues).

I took karate as a kid, my mom was about to take her black belt test, I was good at whatever we had to play in school, I can throw and hit a baseball. I c