Hello there, I've been a "lurker" for a couple weeks now and finally got the courage to post and ask a few questions...a QUICK background on my situation. I am 5'5 about 135lbs...depending on the day. In the past I have been too skinny, too heavy, and now, pretty "normal" (bmi 22.5)..
In the past I was diagnosed with an eating disorder...so calorie restriction was my life...and running 10 miles a day 5 days a week was my workout...that kept me at a pretty low weight..but not happy...then I started to actually gain weight (also my ED kind of shifted to bulimia, so my calorie count was probably never completely on target) with this plan and pretty much steadily maintained my weight at 135 (but not happy with the way I look), while still doing cardio like a maniac and restricting calories...so, to say the least, I wasn't happy with my results and I was ready for a change.
So now I'm ready to do something new, I can't expect to do the same old things I've always done, and get different/better results.
sample day for me:
LIFTING Day: Stage one lifts, HIIT
3/4 c yogurt
3/4 c fiberone cereal
1 scoop whey protein
workout
1 scoop whey protein
yogurt
1/2 c cottage cheese
carrots
Salad: 5 oz turkey, lettuce, Fat free ceasar dressing
1/2 c cottage cheese
Apple
1/2 egg beaters
1 slice fat free cheese
2 fat free hot dogs (I know,that's kind of weird but I like them
1/2 cottage cheese
orange
to me that is a LOT of food...In the past I have maintained with about 1000 cals or less per day, but ate a lot on the weekends....so I'm kind of worried about adding calories right away...should i add them slowly?
I want to loose fat and look slimmer, I don't necessarily want to loose weight b/c I know that the number on the scale doesn't really say much. I am concerned about getting bigger (Im getting married this summer)
I am really determined and I work out hard..If someone told me to jump rope for 2 hours a day to get the results i want, I would do it (but if running 10 miles doesn't work, I would doubt jumping rope would).
My goal is to be toned, I want to LOOK like i work out as hard as I do...right now, if someone looked at me, I don't think they would think that I am a runner and that i work out as much as I do...
any suggestions/ comments are so appreciated!
Sorry for such a long post...I have so much floating around in my head and I just want to bounce if off on you guys and see what you think.
I would absolutely trade fat-free processed foods for healthy-fat whole foods. Example:
fat-free cheese: a small portion of regular cheese, nuts, avocado, natural peanut butter, almond butter
fat-free hotdogs: salmon, tuna, chicken, tofu
Also, please add in some vegetables! (Lettuce doesn't count.) If that's what you're eating on a regular basis you are going to be seriously vitamin deficient.
I agree on less 'fat-free' processed items. Although as I say that I make my own fat-free salad dressings (cornstarch thickened water in place of oil), and I sometimes use reduced fat cheese (in a blend). I tend to favour more natural items lately. I can't do calorie counts off the top of my head so I can't even guess at what the protein/carb/fat ratio is. I think Jane's suggestion is a good one, find a calorie counting program (or a pen and paper/spreadsheet) and total them up to see where you are.
yes I have been treated in the past...I was in an outpatient program..as well as some study related therapy....I still have body image issues, but I think that weight training could give me more confidence..especially if i start seeing results
I have such trouble with vegetables...I cannot find one that I like other than carrots. I have thought about maybe adding some mushrooms or peppers or something to my eggs, but I don't want to make it so that I don't enjoy the food that I eat...If i don't like it, then i tend to not want to eat it and either skip it, or eat something that I shouldn't eat. I wish that I like them more, but I have yet to find one that I look forward to eating...If there are any suggestions of veggies I might like or ways to prepare them in a way that I (a veggie hater) might enjoy, let me know!
I have tofu at my house, and it tastes ok..and I have chicken too, I can try something like that and see how i like it.
what does processed foods do to your body/weight?
The simplest way I can explain it is this: would you put bad gas in your car, knowing it wasn't going to run as well? Of course not. The same applies to fat-free hotdogs and the like. If you read the ingredients it's going to look something like this:
Do you know what sodium erythorbate is? What about sodium nitrite? Chances are nobody has ever said to you, "Make sure you're getting enough sodium nitrite in your diet!"
Additives aren't all bad, but in general they aren't good for you and aren't going to give you what food is supposed to give you: fuel, energy, vitamins, nutrients. The cleaner your diet, the more your food is working for you.
Not all "processed" food is bad - yogurt, milk and tofu are all processed, but the ingredient list is short and they haven't been chemically created or messed with too much.
The simplest way I can explain it is this: would you put bad gas in your car, knowing it wasn't going to run as well? Of course not. The same applies to fat-free hotdogs and the like. If you read the ingredients it's going to look something like this:
Do you know what sodium erythorbate is? What about sodium nitrite? Chances are nobody has ever said to you, "Make sure you're getting enough sodium nitrite in your diet!"
Additives aren't all bad, but in general they aren't good for you and aren't going to give you what food is supposed to give you: fuel, energy, vitamins, nutrients. The cleaner your diet, the more your food is working for you.
Not all "processed" food is bad - yogurt, milk and tofu are all processed, but the ingredient list is short and they haven't been chemically created or messed with too much.
Second everything she said Ideally you want to give your body the best quality food. All that processed food you are eating (egg beaters, hot dogs, fiber one, fat free cheese and dressing) contain tons of additives, preservatives, thickeners. You miss out on a lot of nutrients when you eat "fake" foods like this. They take out the good stuff and add in the junky stuff.
Your menu looks very diet-y. I think you will find real food to be much more satisfying and beneficial for reaching your goals. Your body needs the nutrients to repair itself after these tough workouts.
I can relate to the vegetables! A few years ago, I found myself in a position where I needed to eat more vegetables, and I didn't like any of them! But if you make an effort to cook at least one new vegetable dish a week, you will gradually find tons of vegetables that you like! I find that they're my favorite food now, and I have a nice collection of recipes.
Is it better for me to get the right amount of cals/fat/carbs/protein...or to eat cleaner?? I know I should do both, but I think I gotta do one thing at a time...
I think i'll try to add a different veggie into my diet every week or so..it's hard for me to take out those things that I think make the food that I eat taste good to me...while adding in veggie at the same time...I want to WANT to eat the food I have planned...maybe I'll take out the hot dogs and sub chicken...
also, do you think it'll be ok for me to add calories into my diet right away? have i damaged my metabolism to much?
Im just so confused right now...I want this to work for me...but it's just a TOTAL change from the life i lived before.
Is it better for me to get the right amount of cals/fat/carbs/protein...or to eat cleaner?? I know I should do both, but I think I gotta do one thing at a time...
I think i'll try to add a different veggie into my diet every week or so..it's hard for me to take out those things that I think make the food that I eat taste good to me...while adding in veggie at the same time...I want to WANT to eat the food I have planned...maybe I'll take out the hot dogs and sub chicken...
also, do you think it'll be ok for me to add calories into my diet right away? have i damaged my metabolism to much?
Im just so confused right now...I want this to work for me...but it's just a TOTAL change from the life i lived before.
Eat clean. Count calories. Honestly, it's not hard. If you cut out the hot dogs from what you posted, you're pretty clean already. Replace the hot dogs with a turkey burger made from scratch - just pat lean ground turkey into patties, throw them on the George Foreman grill, and voila. Slap on a piece of lowfat cheese and you've got a cheeseburger. Leave the bun out of it.
On vegetables: You're just going to have to eat them. Don't be afraid to steam them and add a little butter or olive oil and salt. Don't be afraid to hide them in your food - like throwing some sauteed spinach into scrambled eggs, or mixing grated carrots into pretty much anything.
Calories: You'll probably find it easier to increase them over time. Add in 200 more calories a day this week. Then next week, add in another 100 - 200 calories a day. Repeat until you're at your maintenance.
And listen, you're going to gain weight on the scale when you increase your calories. You'll be holding onto water and glycogen like crazy. Very little of it should be fat if you're doing Alwyn's workouts. But given your history, wrap the scale up and hide it in the very back of the closet for the next month or two. It can be frustrating even for people who have a good handle on the mental part of their weight issues. Tuck the scale away. Eat more. Workout hard. You're going to be doing more good things for your body than you can see or measure right away.
Stop thinking about whether the program will "work" or not, because you're setting yourself up for failure. Focus on lifting more, week after week. Focus on eating healthy, whole foods. Focus on your increasing confidence in the weight room. Stop looking for things to go wrong.
Start thinking of your body as more than just some pretty thing to be displayed and get into the strength of how it feels to be a woman who's not afraid of using her muscles.
__________________
"Men are taught to apologize for their weaknesses, women for their strengths." - Lois Wyse
I'm going to add some suggestions in bold in your quoted post below. I think you should focus on both things you asked about in your post, the macros and clean eating, IMO, with one, comes another.
Quote:
Originally Posted by marv
LIFTING Day: Stage one lifts, HIIT
3/4 c yogurt
3/4 c fiberone cereal
1 scoop whey protein is there a less processed cereal you could add? Fiberone is good, yes, but why not look into some homemade granola. If you did that, you could add nuts and seeds for healthy fats and proteins, and watch the overall sugar content. That doesn't look like enough breakfast, at least it wouldn't be for me! I would add some turkey bacon or sausage if that were me, just for added protein and calories
workout do you drink a pwo like the book recommends?
1 scoop whey protein
yogurt why not change it up a little bit? have some cheese and an apple, or make a dip out of greek yogurt and some dill and have that with carrots and celery? I know you said you don't like a lot of veggies, is it because of texture? flavor? try them in different ways!
1/2 c cottage cheese
carrots
Salad: 5 oz turkey, lettuce, Fat free ceasar dressing try full-fat dressing. What else is in your salad. Have you considered trying adding sliced roasted tomatoes? baby romaine?
1/2 c cottage cheese what about eating some almonds here? or try taking some lunch meat and rolling it around cream cheese?
Apple
1/2 egg beaters now, I can't eat whole real eggs, but i honestly think egg beaters aren't the greatest choice. you can beat up some real eggs and egg whites a la cassandra in the book and make soemthing tasty, I'm sure. As for the fat-free cheese, why not try some full fat or 2% cheddar, mozzarella, gouda, havarti, brie? I could go on, I LOVE cheese!
1 slice fat free cheese
2 fat free hot dogs (I know,that's kind of weird but I like theminstead of fat-free hotdogs, try turkey, salmon, chicken breast, beef, tuna, etc. You can prepare the meat of your choice to your liking and eat it with some tasty side dishes
1/2 cottage cheese would there be anything you could eat in place of cottage cheese here? I like eating roasted tomatoes with mozzarella, olive oil, and balsamic vinegar as a side with chicken. it's heavenly!
orange
those are my two cents. I'm sure others will have something to offer as well.
Is it better for me to get the right amount of cals/fat/carbs/protein...or to eat cleaner?? I know I should do both, but I think I gotta do one thing at a time...
The macros and your total calorie intake will always be the priority.
Clean eating is an arbitrary and very poorly defined phrase. I don't like it.
Yes, sticking to whole and minimally processed food sources is for the best. You provide a lot of useful micronutrients that way which can be beneficial.
But "clean eating" is not going to affect your physiology in any meaningful way, assuming the macros are accounted for. It's hardly essential.
It can affect adherence and it might have some psychological effects, but from the standpoint of losing fat, no it doesn't matter at all.
I realize I've just opened a can of worms and somebody's going to start up with the LOL INSULIN STORES FAT!!!11 argument. But I'm ready. Oh yes, I'm ready.
Quote:
also, do you think it'll be ok for me to add calories into my diet right away? have i damaged my metabolism to much?
Ah the specter of metabolic damage.
No, unless you've got thyroid disease you haven't damaged your metabolism at all.
What you've done if anything is lower your base metabolic rate by undereating and overexercising...which isn't uncommon among women
The trick is to *gradually* add calories to your diet. If you've been living on 1500 and suddenly jack it up to 2500, yeah, you're going to gain weight, and it's not magically going to be muscle tissue.
You want to slowly adjust it upwards, and match it to your activity level. The goal is to fuel strength workouts, not just arbitrarily eat more for the sake of it.
Take it step by step.
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Clean eating is an arbitrary and very poorly defined phrase. I don't like it.
Yes, sticking to whole and minimally processed food sources is for the best. You provide a lot of useful micronutrients that way which can be beneficial.
But "clean eating" is not going to affect your physiology in any meaningful way, assuming the macros are accounted for. It's hardly essential.
I get what you're saying but I think getting rid of some of the processed food she's eating and replacing it with real food will definitely help in that her food will be more satisfying. I mean, come on, would you rather have a fat-free hot dog with some fat free cheese or a nice piece of grilled chicken with some mashed sweet potatoes? Which is going to be more beneficial in the long run and is tastier right this second?
I think people who are used to eating processed foods and minimal vegetables should at least try real food and see if they can't change their palate a bit. I think that's really meaningful and certainly more important than just calorie count.
Quote:
I can relate to the vegetables! A few years ago, I found myself in a position where I needed to eat more vegetables, and I didn't like any of them! But if you make an effort to cook at least one new vegetable dish a week, you will gradually find tons of vegetables that you like! I find that they're my favorite food now, and I have a nice collection of recipes.
Absolutely! I think a lot of folks who think they don't like vegetables actually don't like poorly prepared vegetables. marv, experiment a little! Try steaming some fresh veggies and add a little lemon juice or hell, go for a little butter or olive oil. You need some good fat in your diet, for sure. (And there isn't any fat in raisins! They're just sad grapes.)
Dropping below 1200 calories at any time is not good. 1200 is sort of a baseline of what your body needs ...a nd if you're working out a lot, then you need a lot more.
I'm 5'4", currently weigh 168 and I'm losing weight on 1700 cals a day doing the program here. But at 1700 cals, I'm getting lots of vitamins and protein, and able to eat healthy.
Have you done the calorie needs calculations in the book? With your current weight your maintenance calories are probably around 1700 for non-workout days and 2000 for workout days. This program is designed to work while eating at or slightly under maintenance level. I don't think one would get good results from eating too much under. In the book they say the maximum amount to go under is 300 cals/day. When I tried that I could not get through the workouts.
Dropping below 1200 calories at any time is not good. 1200 is sort of a baseline of what your body needs ...a nd if you're working out a lot, then you need a lot more.
And that's just a baseline, ROCK BOTTOM number. NO woman should be going below that, and depending on your height and weight, your number might be much higher. In general, you shouldn't be going below your BMR.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LaraT
Have you done the calorie needs calculations in the book? With your current weight your maintenance calories are probably around 1700 for non-workout days and 2000 for workout days. This program is designed to work while eating at or slightly under maintenance level. I don't think one would get good results from eating too much under. In the book they say the maximum amount to go under is 300 cals/day. When I tried that I could not get through the workouts.
I found a really interesting article the other day. It's a study that talks about how many calories you should cut to lose weight. The basic idea is that the more fat you have to lose, the more you can cut. The less fat you have to lose, the less you can get away with cutting calories and the longer it's going to take to lose weight.
So yes, you should be eating more, Marv! You're going to need that energy. If you had a hundred pounds to lose, you could get away with fewer calories because your body would be burning fat preferentially over muscle. But the leaner you are to start, the more you have to eat close to maintenance.
__________________
"Men are taught to apologize for their weaknesses, women for their strengths." - Lois Wyse
And that's just a baseline, ROCK BOTTOM number. NO woman should be going below that, and depending on your height and weight, your number might be much higher. In general, you shouldn't be going below your BMR.
I found a really interesting article the other day. It's a study that talks about how many calories you should cut to lose weight. The basic idea is that the more fat you have to lose, the more you can cut. The less fat you have to lose, the less you can get away with cutting calories and the longer it's going to take to lose weight.
So yes, you should be eating more, Marv! You're going to need that energy. If you had a hundred pounds to lose, you could get away with fewer calories because your body would be burning fat preferentially over muscle. But the leaner you are to start, the more you have to eat close to maintenance.
I have read that as well. People with a good deal of weight to lose can "afford" the greater calorie deficit without the risk of losing muscle compared to those with less to lose.
I fall into the "less to lose" category myself and always been the type to want to lose fast and see the scale go down but I realized that while I would lose that way it almost always came back, I felt deprived, etc and would overeat and gain back the weight. I committed to doing something different by following this program and eating much more and not relying on the scale for validation. I am slowly but surely losing inches but gaining strength and definition. I feel so much more at peace I can't begin to describe it.
I used thedailyplate and that's what I got...?..
I can assure you that I will be adding more fat, I am just concerned about adding to many calories at one time...but really like things like nuts and peanut butter, so I plan on adding them in the future
Maybe I'm looking at this wrong, but I don't see 160 grams of protein.
And, 11G of fat!! That's WAY low! Nuts! Natural peanut butter! Whole eggs! Olive Oil! They are your friends.
Not only that, but your numbers don't add up to the amount of calories you posted.
I recommend a good book on food. I really like Tosca Reno's Eat Clean Diet and Eat Clean Diet cookbook for foods. It's not a diet in the traditional, count calories sense. She just shows you how to incorporate more healthy, whole foods into your life rather painlessly.
__________________
"Men are taught to apologize for their weaknesses, women for their strengths." - Lois Wyse
Start thinking of your body as more than just some pretty thing to be displayed and get into the strength of how it feels to be a woman who's not afraid of using her muscles.
Marv,
I also have a history with eating disorders, started at a very early age and restricted calories and over exercised. At 5'4" with a medium to large frame (according to wrist size), I graduated high school at 98lbs. Since then, I've been as heavy as 175 and as light as 115. I'm also now at a normal weight--138 this morning. And, after doing NROL4W and getting my calorie intake up to where it should be, I like the way I look so much better. I started the program at 136 lbs with a pretty bad body image, have gained two pounds, and look and feel so much better. I hope it does the same for you. And, I've actually gone down in pant size.
That said, add extra calories slowly. I'd suggest 100-200 extra each week. Adding peanut butter to an apple will get you there, plus it'll add more fat to your diet and it's delicious! Almonds are also really good. And, if you like it hummus with homemade whole wheat pita chips.
I noticed you don't really have any fruit in your diet either. Do you feel the same way about fruit as you do the vegetables? Something I do is sneak fruits and vegetables into meals. My boyfriend and his son both claim to hate vegetables, but they love it when I make hamburgers with shredded zucchini mixed into the meat. It also works great with ground turkey for turkey burgers.
Good luck with the program. I agree with the others in this thread, you will need the energy from food in order to make it though the workouts. And congratulations on your upcoming wedding!
I recommend a good book on food. I really like Tosca Reno's Eat Clean Diet and Eat Clean Diet cookbook for foods. It's not a diet in the traditional, count calories sense. She just shows you how to incorporate more healthy, whole foods into your life rather painlessly.
I almost forgot...I got both of these books Friday, read them that night and into Saturday, and love them! The recipes in the books are excellent (I've already tried four!) and the way they're written really make them enjoyable. I second this recommendation.
1250 cals ( I know that's pretty low..I'll work on increasing *gradually*)
160g carb
160g protein
11g fat
Wow that seems WAAAAYYYY out of proportion for me. 160g of protein? And only 11g of fat? That's almost an impossible proportion to obtain.
There's a formula in the book (I don't have ti with me right now, but I'll post the page # later tonight) that will guide you in how many cals you need for lifting days vs. non lifting days. It'll be a lot more than 1200, I'm sure!
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