NROL vs NORL4W

[Kates310]

First off, Id like to say hello all. Im am new to the forum, but not new to lifting. I am almost to stage 2 in NROL4W and Ive been reading the forums on here. I was wondering if NROW (the original) is mostly geared towards men or is it for both men and women. Ive been lifting for several years and while I read the book NROLW (since Im a woman) I got the feeling it was aimed more at beginners and people who arent used to being around the gym and using weights. How different is NROL. I was thinking of buying it off of amazon used simply because I love reading up on fitness. But the more I read it the more I think Id be better off doing those workouts? Any input? Have any of you ladies tried the original books workouts? How did you like them compared to NROLW? My main goal is fat loss and keeping/adding lean muscle.
Thanks in advance for any ideas. Sorry for such a long thread.

[SpacecityPaula]

Either book can be used for what you want. I used NROL last year and the workouts are just as difficult as the workouts we are using here.

[missjane]

NROL is composed of separate workouts that can be done in different order, based upon specific goals. It is either for men or women.

NROL4W is a 6-stage program designed to be done from start to finish.

I wouldn't say either program is aimed at either beginners or more experienced. You still will choose the weight that is appropriate for your level, so both will work for newbies and advanced lifters.

Once I finish NROL4W, I will go back to NROL (which is where I came from). Both programs are great.

[LisaS]

The non-workout content of the books is different and I think you'd benefit from both.

NROL4W in the body primarily addresses some of the common myths and issues surrounding women and weight training. It is well done for that purpose.

NROL in the body of the book addresses the "whys" behind compound exercises vs. isolation exercises. It is well done for that purpose. It goes into detail about the basic motions (squat, DL, lunge, press, pull, rotation).

As far as the workouts go - NROL is a set of 9 (I think) workout routines plus a break-in routine. The intent of the book is that you can set your own plan of navigation from routine to routine depending on your goals - though there are some suggested patterns.

On the other hand, the workout plan in NROL4W is a series of 7 routines, designed to be completed in sequence in about 6-7 months.

The exercise selections and the difficulty of routines is comparable.

[Cynthia]

Originally Posted by LisaS

The non-workout content of the books is different and I think you'd benefit from both.

I agree with this. I bought the original for hubby and was surprised at all the good content in it that wasn't included in NROL4W. I assume that was done for duplication purposes, I imagine a lot of the women buying the newest version had probably already read the original.

[rixatrix]

I think the biggest reason Lou put out a book "for women" was just to package all the key points of the other book, but deliver it in a way that would seem friendlier and more attractive to women. I have both. I've had NROL for a while now and it's a great book. NROL4W just speak specifically to the concerns of women - Will I get bulky? Can't I just use Barbie weights to "tone" my muscles? Why should I eat so much?

The message of both books is essentially the same. Lift big, use compound movements, and watch your body improve.

[Lou Schuler]

Cynthia and Rix, you're both right.

The goal of NROL was to simplify workout methodology for guys who were getting confused by all the complications being introduced by people like me and the trainers I worked with on books and magazine projects.

I thought it would be useful to start as simply as possible -- six simple and functional human movements, the most basic form of progressive resistance -- and then show how to use those building blocks to create a long-term workout program.

The idea to write NROL for Women (the original title was Lift Like a Man) came from readers like you, who took me to task for making the information too male-centric.

I didn't want to repeat all the building-block information in the book for women. Mostly, I think repetition would be cheating readers. But as Rixatrix said, the information is still in there; a lot of it is just implied rather than explained in detail.

Ideally, the two books should be complementary, even though the decision to make the women's book part of the "New Rules" brand was made after it was written, edited, photographed, and designed.

[RedWifey]

I think you'll have no trouble being taxed, stressed, stretched and improved by the workouts in NROL4W. I've been working out (off and on) for 7-8 years now (wow, that's crazy to say) and this Stage 2 is kicking my butt.

[rixatrix]

Originally Posted by RedWifey

I think you'll have no trouble being taxed, stressed, stretched and improved by the workouts in NROL4W. I've been working out (off and on) for 7-8 years now (wow, that's crazy to say) and this Stage 2 is kicking my butt.

Yes! I just started Stage 2 this week and I was practically in tears last night when I couldn't fall asleep early enough to squeeze in 8 hours of much-needed rest before my 5am gym wake up call.

It's not called New Rules of Lifting for Little Girls - don't let the "Woman" part trick you into thinking it's any easier!

[Lou Schuler]

It's not called New Rules of Lifting for Little Girls - don't let the "Woman" part trick you into thinking it's any easier!

Did you see my blog post yesterday, about push-ups? If little girls can do them (like my 9-year-old daughter, and the preteen soccer players I observed), adult women should be able to.

On a regulation push-up, you're pressing about 60 percent of your body weight. If you weigh 140 pounds, that's the equivalent of an 85-pound bench press, which doesn't strike me as unreasonable at all.

The workouts in NROL4W are tough for anybody. I found them challenging, and I experienced muscle growth where I wasn't used to it. (All those unusual lunge variations really hit my thighs, calves, and hips.) I'd been having some shoulder problems, which went away while I was doing Alwyn's workouts.

Strength is cool no matter your gender or age. And weakness isn't feminine -- it's debilitating.

[Kates310]

Thanks for all of the great input everybody! I order NROL used off of Amazon yesterday just for a good read. But I think I will continue on to stage 2 of NROL4W. The rest of the stages look very challenging and that interests me more than anything.
Thanks again!

[Cynthia]

Originally Posted by Lou Schuler

Did you see my blog post yesterday, about push-ups? If little girls can do them (like my 9-year-old daughter, and the preteen soccer players I observed), adult women should be able to.

On a regulation push-up, you're pressing about 60 percent of your body weight. If you weigh 140 pounds, that's the equivalent of an 85-pound bench press, which doesn't strike me as unreasonable at all.

The workouts in NROL4W are tough for anybody. I found them challenging, and I experienced muscle growth where I wasn't used to it. (All those unusual lunge variations really hit my thighs, calves, and hips.) I'd been having some shoulder problems, which went away while I was doing Alwyn's workouts.

Strength is cool no matter your gender or age. And weakness isn't feminine -- it's debilitating.

I felt like such a huge success when I was able to do my first set of "real" pushups (which was just a month ago!)!! Understanding that it is the equivalent of benching 102 pounds (I weigh ~170) now helps me understand why it was so difficult for me to get to that point!

Yesterday I completed Stage 2, Workout 3A and I said to my husband as I was leaving the gym, 'Dang, you know your workout is tough when the pushups are the easy part!'

[citymouse]

Originally Posted by Cynthia

Yesterday I completed Stage 2, Workout 3A and I said to my husband as I was leaving the gym, 'Dang, you know your workout is tough when the pushups are the easy part!'

I'm looking forward to that day.

[Cynic]

Originally Posted by Lou Schuler

Did you see my blog post yesterday, about push-ups? If little girls can do them (like my 9-year-old daughter, and the preteen soccer players I observed), adult women should be able to.

I just saw that. So many of those women weren't even doing genuine push-ups! If that had been an Army PT test, none of those would have counted.

That little bit in the beginning, with the three soldiers...that's a push-up! The body in a rigid straight line, lowering until the upper arms break the parallel, then back to the leaning rest (some things get ingrained in basic).

[ledove]

I don't know if a single woman in there was doing push-ups. Most were dropping their shoulders a little bit then dropping their pelvis to the floor and calling it a "push-up." (Of course, I had to close my office door after watching/reading that and do 20 real push-ups.)

...researchers have shown that the wrist alone is subjected to an impact force equal to about one body weight...

Unrelated to push-ups: There were several paragraphs in that article about doing push-ups to strengthen your wrists so that you can catch yourself when you fall and not break your wrists. I understand the point they were trying to make, but your wrists are a bad place to land when you fall, even though it's instinctive to reach out to the floor. I dislocated my elbow by catching myself on my wrist, even though I knew better. Instead, try to land in the Plank position, forearms flat on the ground and head turned to one side. It might sting your forearms more, but you're less likely to break or dislocate anything. (Had to throw that in; those paragraphs made me cringe.)

[feralBoy]

Originally Posted by ledove

Unrelated to push-ups: There were several paragraphs in that article about doing push-ups to strengthen your wrists so that you can catch yourself when you fall and not break your wrists. I understand the point they were trying to make, but your wrists are a bad place to land when you fall, even though it's instinctive to reach out to the floor. I dislocated my elbow by catching myself on my wrist, even though I knew better. Instead, try to land in the Plank position, forearms flat on the ground and head turned to one side. It might sting your forearms more, but you're less likely to break or dislocate anything. (Had to throw that in; those paragraphs made me cringe.)

Yeah, I definitely fractured my radius bone trying to brace my fall with my hands. I just kept saying to myself, thank god it wasn't my wrist. Probably one of the worst places to injure.

As far as the plank, they teach you something similar to that in martial arts. Same when you are falling backwards. You brace your fall by slapping your forearms to the ground.

[ledove]

Originally Posted by feralBoy

As far as the plank, they teach you something similar to that in martial arts. Same when you are falling backwards. You brace your fall by slapping your forearms to the ground.

Yeah, joints aren't so good at taking impact. Larger surface areas are better.

My elbow dislocated while I was falling backward/sideways during sparring. I seriously heard the words "Hey, watch this!" go through my head right before I fell. The "plan" was to interrupt my fall by catching myself on my wrist, jump back up, and kick the other guy upside the head. I am now the class example for why we don't land on our wrists...