Apprehensive about whey

[erb5]

I've just finished NROL4W it is excellent; I am very excited to get started on the workouts.

The only part of the book I found off-putting was on page 72, the "ironclad rules," specifically "you must have a post-workout recovery shake on the days you lift."

I'm a little apprehensive about whey since I consider it a "supplement" and would prefer to get my nutrients from whole foods. These concerns were not assuaged by the pullout on pages 73-74 that continued to discuss whey as a "supplement."

After a little more research today, I'm somewhat less apprehensive to try it, however, why is whey alone so essential? And why does it only seem to be available in a powdered form as a "nutritional supplement?" I'm really trying to have an open mind about it, but whey powder currently creeps me out!

More personally, I work out in the mornings and don't like sweet tastes for breakfast. Are their any more savory whey recipes than the shakes and bars mentioned?

While I'm "complaining" about that, I must add that the other recipes look excellent. I think I might be most excited by the simple "snack" suggestions! And I love that most are easy to pack up to take to work.

Regarding the workouts, I don't have a bar for chin ups, pull ups, etc. It appears only the negative chin up is affected, however, it's partnered with what I would guess would be its "alternative" exercise, the underhand grip lat pull down. Substitution suggestions? (I am hopeful from my once through that that's the only issue for me!)

Finally, I hope this is just a fluke, but I ordered two copies of the book and both seem to have binding issues. After only 24 hours, my book is separated from the binding and only the end papers are holding the book together. I ordered both online but am hoping to return them in-store for replacements. I'm guessing it was a just a bad run (end of the glue, or something!). Did anyone else have issues?

It's a great book, I can't have it falling apart on me already!

[LisaS]

Originally Posted by erb5

Finally, I hope this is just a fluke, but I ordered two copies of the book and both seem to have binding issues. After only 24 hours, my book is separated from the binding and only the end papers are holding the book together. I ordered both online but am hoping to return them in-store for replacements. I'm guessing it was a just a bad run (end of the glue, or something!). Did anyone else have issues?

It's a great book, I can't have it falling apart on me already!

RedWifey reports that her book (from B&N) also had binding issues B&N releasing early?

[Aoife]

I don't get why people think whey isn't a food. Do you say powdered milk isn't a food? Whey is barely different, it's just part of the milk, basically the by-product of cottage cheese production dried up because it's better than being wet and ikky.

[Victoria]

Originally Posted by LisaS

RedWifey reports that her book (from B&N) also had binding issues B&N releasing early?

Same here....

[LisaS]

Originally Posted by erb5

More personally, I work out in the mornings and don't like sweet tastes for breakfast. Are their any more savory whey recipes than the shakes and bars mentioned?

I [generally] have shakes for breakfast every weekday. Have done this for more than a year. Espresso powder makes for a good shake with vanilla pp if I'm not in the mood for fruit flavors. On the other hand, you can just use something like vanilla pp in water and chug it down - it doesn't have to be savored like a meal - just consumed.

I don't have my book yet and so I'm not sure of the reasoning behind mandating a PWO drink - but if solid food appeals more and isn't against the plan, you could take some pp in cottage cheese with salsa for a savory flavor.

[Cassandra Forsythe]

Hi erb5

Thanks for the feedback!

In the book, on pages 80 to 82, I did include savory breakfest recipes such as omelets, breakfast burritos and fried eggs with Canadian bacon. Did you see those?

For whey, the reason we put emphasis on it PWO is because there is so much research and personal experience with including it in one's post-workout food consumption to aid in recovery. And, with Alwyn's program, recovery is much needed Whey is considered a supplement for a few reasons: a) it's seperated from it's original source, b) the dietetic association does not think one needs to consume more than 0.8g/kg of protein, so adding whey to the diet puts one over. We all know how much they've gone wrong with diet issues though.

However, if you do prefer to eat a whole meal after your workout, that's ok. Just ensure it contains a complete protein source and a healthy complex carb source, especially if body recomposition is your goal.

What ideas did you have in mind?

[Cynic]

Originally Posted by Cassandra Forsythe

And, with Alwyn's program, recovery is much needed

Alwyn is already the favorite for understatement of the year with his Fitcast quote: "People may find my workouts are a bit more intense then their used to."

However...you could unseat him. It's always a possibility.

[erb5]

I don't get why people think whey isn't a food. Do you say powdered milk isn't a food? Whey is barely different, it's just part of the milk, basically the by-product of cottage cheese production dried up because it's better than being wet and ikky.

I will readily admit its primarily unfamiliarity. Additionally, because it's marketed--and generally available--as a "supplement." And while little Miss Muffet seemed to enjoy hers with curds , I don't think she mixed a powder into her liquidy curds. These latter two factors combined make me question exactly what I'm getting from a whey canister.

In the book, on pages 80 to 82, I did include savory breakfest recipes such as omelets, breakfast burritos and fried eggs with Canadian bacon. Did you see those?

Absolutely! They look great; however, those are separate from the shakes and do not include the powder as part of their ingredients. If I'm supposed to drink/eat something with whey for recovery after working out, that would be in the morning, so it would naturally be part of my breakfast!

However, if you do prefer to eat a whole meal after your workout, that's ok. Just ensure it contains a complete protein source and a healthy complex carb source, especially if body recomposition is your goal.
What ideas did you have in mind?

I may just go with this, at least at first. Or I might just try downing whey with water... dunno. My main goal is to improve my overall body composition.

[Cynic]

Originally Posted by erb5

I will readily admit its primarily unfamiliarity. Additionally, because it's marketed--and generally available--as a "supplement." And while little Miss Muffet seemed to enjoy hers with curds , I don't think she mixed a powder into her liquidy curds. These latter two factors combined make me question exactly what I'm getting from a whey canister.

I can kind of see you point, but keep in mind, a company busted on hidding things will not last long.

Here is an idea if you are very hesitant, though it will be predominantly casein:

1 cup skim milk: 8g protein
1 cup fat free yogurt: approx 12g protein. Go ahead and use a flavored one, such as Dannon's Vanilla. The sugar wil help with the insulin response.
1/2 cp fat free cottage cheese, approx 13g protein.
honey and fruit for additional flavor.

Blend until smooth.

[Lost Dog]

BTW, you can buy unflavored and unsweetened whey powder at trueprotein.com. I'm sure it would be "delicious" with chicken broth or V8. Yummmm...

Or

Soylent Green

Use unflavored and unsweetened powder, drop the Splenda, and add some salt and seasoning, and you have a pocket fritatta. Is that a quiche in your pocket, or are you just... ah, you know the rest.

Although, I have to agree with Lisa. It doesn't have to be enjoyable, just not nasty. It takes me about 5 seconds to down a pwo drink. If it doesn't come back, it was a success. Cheers!

[Azure]

I also wanted to note that my copy (from B&N--I bought it over the weekend) also has some binding issues. I'm sure the pages will start coming out soon, but I'm trying to treat it with care to prevent it for as long as possible. It's a really good read, though. I plowed through it over the weekend and I enjoyed it--can't wait to start!

[Cassandra Forsythe]

Originally Posted by erb5

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More personally, I work out in the mornings and don't like sweet tastes for breakfast. Are their any more savory whey recipes than the shakes and bars mentioned?

Hi again Erb5,

To tell you the truth, I missed that you said you worked out in the morning. When I first read this post and responded, I was babysitting my two neices and wasn't reading carefully enough (one was sleeping and the other was watching TV, so I was good to check the internet for a minute or two).

Anyhow, if you prefer to workout in the morning and you don't want to have a sweeter breakfast, the meals that contain a complete protein source (eggs, meat, poultry, fish, etc) that are more appealing to you, may be used. Just make sure they do contain some carbohydrate (like a slice of toasted sprouted grain organic bread [not made with flour], or some fresh fruit, etc) to replish liver and muscle glycogen and to get your insulin levels up for improved protein repair. Then, you'll likely need to eat again after 2 to 3 hours, and at that time, if you like, you can include a whey shake or just another complete protein meal.

If you want to have whey at some time, I like to mix whey with water and pour it over a whole grain cereal, like shredded wheat or Kashi puffed grains (both do not contain sugar and are good if you do not tolerate simple carbs well). (you can also mix the whey with milk if that's what you like).

Sorry for missing your first point.

Cass

[cycomiko]

Whey is often marketed as a supplement due to labelling requirements, not because it is magically a 'oooooohhhh' - a supplement.

[erb5]

Thanks for all the replies!

Regarding the binding issue, I returned my two copies to the store (Barnes & Noble) and they were very nice, letting me pick through the ones that were out to find ones that seemed better. I'm hoping the two I have now will last longer (my first one literally fell apart despite being handled with kid gloves) and so far, so good! But be alert if you're buying in store. There were definitely pages pulling away from the spine in a few of their copies on the shelf.

All the whey proponents will be happy to know that over the weekend I purchased whey at my grocery store. I bought Bob's Red Mill "Whey Protein Concentrate." It was in the organic section and was simply the first place I looked for it. It also seemed "unadulterated," so I figured was easier to mix with other flavors.

I mixed equal parts powder (1/8 cup) with water and then mixed that in with an egg and scrambled it. Even plain, it was fine, but with salt and pepper, good and with (my favorite) Red Hot, downright enjoyable. As part of a breakfast sandwich, I doubt I'll notice the whey.

I appreciate all the suggestions for recipes and will definitely keep them in mind. I can't tell if you're kidding, Lost Dog, about putting it in chicken broth, but I'm absolutely going to try that! I would definitely eat a little "soup" for breakfast.

Cassandra, no worries about missing my point initially, I just didn't want you to think I hadn't read through all your recipes! (Or worse, bothered to even read the book before asking a question!) I am completely floored that I can even ask the authors anything and get a response; I appreciate your time very much.

So now that I've figured out how to get some whey into my diet, I hope I can ask one more question: How many grams of protein should I get from the whey post workout? Here's the nutrition info for the whey I bought:

Nutritional Information for
Whey Protein Concentrate
Serving Size 1/4 cup (20g) Servings Per Container 17.00
Calories 80.00
Calories from Fat 10.00
Total Fat 1.00g
Saturated Fat 0.50g
Trans Fat 0.00g
Cholesterol 30.00mg
Sodium 40.00mg
Total Carbohydrate 1.00g
Dietary Fiber 0.00g
Sugars 1.00g
Protein 16.00g
Ingredients Whey Protein (Milk) and Soy Lecithin.

I'll likely be eating it with eggs; I think one egg will "mask" 1/8 cup of powder.

I hope your nieces were good for you!

Thanks again, Cassandra, and everyone else for the suggestions.

[Cynic]

Not too impressed with the quantity per unit volume. Sixteen grams per scoop is actually pretty skimpy and the price is rather outrageous.

You might want to look at trueprotein.com

I used to use ON and still have a large supply of it, but the price shot up bigtime so I'm looking for a more cost effective solution. True protein is still pretty reasonable for the whey concentrate and you can get it plain if you wish.

[Aoife]

To be fair, ON whey is 24g protein /30g scoop whereas this is only a 20g scoop serving size. So 16g isn't really off, it's .8g protein per gram... ON is the same .8g protein per gram serving. And the calorie ratio is the same too.