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The New Rules of Lifting - The Original Based on the original book by Lou Schuler with workout programs by Alwyn Cosgrove

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Old 05-08-2007, 09:08 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default exercise substitutions

I work out in a basement with a low ceiling; I can press an empty bar overhead but not one with any plates loaded.

For BI I did a seated dumbell press. I will start FL1 and intend to use either a seated DB press or a seated BB press as a substitute for the press. I presume it is ok to reuse the DB press, but any comments would be appreciated.

I did manage to get a squat rack with a high pulley (for $100 !), but I do need to make substitutes for exercises with a low pulley; I am planning on doing a DB row for that; again any comments or suggestions about exercise substitutions would be appreciated.

Thanks.
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Old 05-08-2007, 09:36 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Sounds good to me.
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Old 05-08-2007, 12:29 PM   #3 (permalink)
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The DB row to replace the seated cable row is a good substitution.

For the overhead pressing, in BI you were doing a single-arm DB overhead press. FL-I calls for a DB push press, so you'd be using DBs again anyway even if you were standing. The bigger issue is sitting instead of standing. The principles behind these fat loss workouts is that you're working your whole body during almost every movement. Standing is a big part of that. So, if you do use a seated DB overhead press, be sure to sit up tall on the end of the bench and don't lean back onto any back support.

Another option would be tall kneeling (where you're on both knees, hips up). You'll just have to try it and see if you feel stable getting the DBs to your shoulders from that position. That will depend a lot on how much weight you're pushing. Just try it and see if you can do a DB overhead press/push press from a tall kneeling position. This position will be much more challenging to your core than sitting on a bench, so it will be much closer to the challenge of standing.

Another option, if you have the flexibility for it, is seated on the floor with your legs straight out in front of you. This gets further away from the push press, but I like it a lot better than seated on a bench. This is a great lift. If you scroll down to number 24 you can see a picture of Pavel doing the floor seated press with one kettlebell. You can use two DBs together just as well.

Either of the last two choices will be preferable and more difficult than seated on the edge of your bench.
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Old 05-08-2007, 12:56 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Or sit on an exercise ball - that forces you to keep your back straight and maintain some balance. That's what I'm forced to do in my basement. My ceiling is so low, I can't do anything overhead.
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Old 05-09-2007, 07:30 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Thank you, this is just what I needed to hear. This forum is incredible.
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Old 05-09-2007, 08:21 AM   #6 (permalink)
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or you can go upstairs to do the exercise...(and trust me i know that walking up the stairs in the midst of these workouts is NOT easy)..but it does allow you to do the proper exercise without sub-ing...(hint:have the DBs up there BEFORE you start...)
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Old 05-09-2007, 10:12 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lisa~
Another option would be tall kneeling (where you're on both knees, hips up). You'll just have to try it and see if you feel stable getting the DBs to your shoulders from that position. That will depend a lot on how much weight you're pushing. Just try it and see if you can do a DB overhead press/push press from a tall kneeling position. This position will be much more challenging to your core than sitting on a bench, so it will be much closer to the challenge of standing.
I guess I'm a bit confused about the tall kneeling position. Are you just basicly sitting on your knees with your body making an "L" figure? Does that make any sense?
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Old 05-09-2007, 10:40 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Defiant1
I guess I'm a bit confused about the tall kneeling position. Are you just basicly sitting on your knees with your body making an "L" figure? Does that make any sense?
Yes. Tall kneeling has both knees on the ground, as opposed to half kneeling where one knee is on the ground. (Think of your sport's coach saying, "Take a knee." That's half kneeling.)

I tried to find pictures. Here is what your legs look like when you're tall kneeling. You don't have to put your knees on pads unless the floor hurts your knees, lol.


Here's a guy doing a cable chop from a tall kneeling position:
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Old 05-09-2007, 11:29 AM   #9 (permalink)
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I would use bent over barbell rows to sub in for cable rows. It's a bilateral movement drawing in both arms/hands to move the weight, thus gaining by the synergistic affect and training both arms to work together.

DB rows are unilateral.

They both have their place, but I try to match the exercises movement pattern as close as possible.
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Old 05-09-2007, 12:51 PM   #10 (permalink)
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My bands from Dave Schmitz just arrived! These might substitute quite nicely in an overhead limited space. I tried some overhead presses, and it seemed to feel about right.
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Old 05-10-2007, 11:39 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Thanks Lisa. I'm going to try that out because it really sucks making trips up and down stairs carrying a barbell and weights on top of making trips up and down stairs in between supersets. Hmmmm...no wonder I always seem to be so much weaker on my 2nd and 3rd set of that superset combo.

I have been subbing in BB pullovers on a swissball in place of the the lat pulldowns because of my lack of authority and proper equipment. In order to change them up within each program I've used the same grips that it calls for in the book on the lat pulldowns. These seem to be working as I can definately feel my lats the next day and it seems to really work my core as well. Right now I'm doing reverse grip pullovers which are a bit more tricky than the overhand grip ones, but they feel pretty good the next day.
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Old 05-10-2007, 12:04 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cynic
I would use bent over barbell rows to sub in for cable rows. It's a bilateral movement drawing in both arms/hands to move the weight, thus gaining by the synergistic affect and training both arms to work together.

DB rows are unilateral.

They both have their place, but I try to match the exercises movement pattern as close as possible.
Good point Cynic. I agree with you.
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Old 05-10-2007, 12:38 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Defiant1
Thanks Lisa. I'm going to try that out because it really sucks making trips up and down stairs carrying a barbell and weights on top of making trips up and down stairs in between supersets. Hmmmm...no wonder I always seem to be so much weaker on my 2nd and 3rd set of that superset combo.

I have been subbing in BB pullovers on a swissball in place of the the lat pulldowns because of my lack of authority and proper equipment. In order to change them up within each program I've used the same grips that it calls for in the book on the lat pulldowns. These seem to be working as I can definately feel my lats the next day and it seems to really work my core as well. Right now I'm doing reverse grip pullovers which are a bit more tricky than the overhand grip ones, but they feel pretty good the next day.
Do you not have the option to do pull-ups or chin-ups instead of lat pulldowns?
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Old 05-10-2007, 01:22 PM   #14 (permalink)
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as for low-pulley, you can kinda make one with bands.

there's some difficulty in monitoring progress in terms of intensity (you need to measure the distance from the rack, etc) and it's hard to get the right distance, but I've used them for things like pull-throughs and it's definitely worth experimenting with...
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Old 05-10-2007, 01:28 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lisa~
Do you not have the option to do pull-ups or chin-ups instead of lat pulldowns?
Right now I do not. I workout in my basement and the ceiling just isn't high enough for it. I was thinking of getting a door gym or some contraption like that, or possibly building a pull up bar contraption out by my deck, but it puts me into the situation where its impossible to do the correct rests when I'm running back and forth from my basement, to upstairs, to outside and back. Plus at this point I can't complete 12 pull-ups or chin-ups without assistance.
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Old 05-10-2007, 05:02 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Defiant1
Right now I do not. I workout in my basement and the ceiling just isn't high enough for it. I was thinking of getting a door gym or some contraption like that, or possibly building a pull up bar contraption out by my deck, but it puts me into the situation where its impossible to do the correct rests when I'm running back and forth from my basement, to upstairs, to outside and back. Plus at this point I can't complete 12 pull-ups or chin-ups without assistance.
I don't have a pulley station at home, so here's what I do (hopefully you have a rack):

I put the bar in the highest position possible that will give me enough range of motion. Then I'll fold up my legs so I'm not hitting the floor and do my pull-ups that way. Hopefully you can do the same. If you don't have the strength to do pull-ups, invest in bands or use a chair.
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Old 05-11-2007, 03:20 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Quote:
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Good point Cynic. I agree with you.
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Old 05-16-2007, 09:04 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lisa~
Yes. Tall kneeling has both knees on the ground, as opposed to half kneeling where one knee is on the ground. (Think of your sport's coach saying, "Take a knee." That's half kneeling.)

I tried to find pictures. Here is what your legs look like when you're tall kneeling. You don't have to put your knees on pads unless the floor hurts your knees, lol.

Well I did the kneeling barbell push presses last night and it went great. It actually kind of surprised me that even though I'm kneeling, it still works a decent amount of the core and hips, much better than seated on a bench. Thanks again for the suggestion Lisa~.
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Old 05-16-2007, 12:19 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Defiant1
Well I did the kneeling barbell push presses last night and it went great. It actually kind of surprised me that even though I'm kneeling, it still works a decent amount of the core and hips, much better than seated on a bench. Thanks again for the suggestion Lisa~.
You're welcome! I'm glad it worked for you.
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