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I remember reading this detailed article about the 'top 10' traits that obese people have in common.
According to the article, the number 1 thing that obese people have in common is that they do not eat breakfast. In fact, the article said that they don't eat until "late afternoon"
Other traits were, high sugar/carbs, seditary lifestyle, etc.
anyway, what is your thoughts on this?
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You are not going to ever nail down specific traits for someone who is obese because you are talking about people. For every one person that is obese that doesn't eat breakfast you will findone that does.
I can say that if I were forced to list a top 5 common traits of people who are more than 35% bodyfat they would be...
Sedentary Jobs
Family/friends are overweight
Were overweight as children
Pregnancy
Marriage
The worst obese I have worked with have the combination of the first three everytime.
I remember reading this detailed article about the 'top 10' traits that obese people have in common.
According to the article, the number 1 thing that obese people have in common is that they do not eat breakfast. In fact, the article said that they don't eat until "late afternoon"
Other traits were, high sugar/carbs, seditary lifestyle, etc.
anyway, what is your thoughts on this?
If you don't eat until late in the day that's actually a good strategy to reduce your overall intake IF you keep a handle on what you eat. If you're slamming down two pizzas and a trip to the buffet bc you're hungry from starving all day, that's a different matter.
Intermittent fasting strategies actually do work, however. THey just require that you don't binge out bc you starved all day long.
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If you don't eat until late in the day that's actually a good strategy to reduce your overall intake IF you keep a handle on what you eat. If you're slamming down two pizzas and a trip to the buffet bc you're hungry from starving all day, that's a different matter.
Intermittent fasting strategies actually do work, however. THey just require that you don't binge out bc you starved all day long.
I agree, intermittant fasting is pretty useful.
But the OP is probably still correct, most fat people probably still don't eat breakfast, and do binge later in the day.
I know with me that was the case. I would often not eat breakfast OR lunch. Obviously I was getting the calories in elsewhere.
I don't know what I think about the idea stated in the original thread. I'm inclined to believe that there's some truth to it. I remember reading a study or two that found that one thing 'naturally' thin people tend to have in common is that they eat a decent breakfast. I'm not sure about the correlation/causation pathway here though.
What is it about eating a reasonable breakfast that contributes to a healthy body weight? Does eating breakfast just naturally lead to an overall healthier intake of calories? Does it influence the metabolism? Does not eating breakfast lead to binging either because of increased hunger later in the day, or the perception that 'I didn't eat breakfast so I can have this treat'? Does not eating until later in the day lead to changes in cravings for less healthy foods? How does all this tie together?
I also know that there are a few studies that show that intermittent fasting can help with weight loss. I haven't read through them in detail, but I tend to believe that intermittent fasting can be okay if you are making good concious decisions about your overall intake. That's a lot different than just doing it out of habit or to save calories for later. I don't know if that makes sense?
That's the only one of the five that applied to me. At times I've had sedentary jobs, but at my top weight I had moved into jobs where I was on my feet all day. Now, being on my feet all day and not eating enough during the day left me ravenous at the end of the day, so I ate enough to make up for it.
Oh, and seriously, there isn't one specific set of circumstances that all fat people share. Just as there isn't one set of circumstances that all thin people share.
Intermittent fasting strategies actually do work, however. THey just require that you don't binge out bc you starved all day long.
My biggest struggle... Turns out I need to monitor my calorie intake, too.
It still seems to be better for me than 4-5 smaller feedings and it sure takes the cooking/packing food pressure off.
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Originally Posted by Snarlla
I know with me that was the case. I would often not eat breakfast OR lunch. Obviously I was getting the calories in elsewhere.
I loooooved (and love) my breakfast. I was obese and ate many meals throughout the day, starting with something tasty upon waking.
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I don't know what I think about the idea stated in the original thread. I'm inclined to believe that there's some truth to it. I remember reading a study or two that found that one thing 'naturally' thin people tend to have in common is that they eat a decent breakfast. I'm not sure about the correlation/causation pathway here though.
People who watch their weight, health, etc. might tend to eat breakfast BECAUSE they believe that it's healthier to do so. "Breakfast is the most important meal of the day" is a mantra for some reason.
Healthy people also brush and floss more, so that's probably why there's that correlation between heart health and gum disease.
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Does eating breakfast just naturally lead to an overall healthier intake of calories?
Not naturally, no. Naturally thin people naturally eat the right amounts of food. Lucky bastards.
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Does not eating breakfast lead to binging either because of increased hunger later in the day, or the perception that 'I didn't eat breakfast so I can have this treat'?
both can be happen. The perception is a big part of it. Also, if you're not used to long periods without food, you can get REALLY hungry. It took me several weeks to get used to being able to go until 2 or 4 in the afternoon. I don't fast longer than that, so I get really hungry if I try to last until 5 or 6. Then, it's all I can do to limit my portions. I have to be careful.
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Does not eating until later in the day lead to changes in cravings for less healthy foods?
I don't think so. I think that routinely eating less healthy foods leads to more cravings. When you're really hungry, you're less able to suppress cravings, maybe.
Something I have noticed in my own life when I have been at my heaviest points:
STRESS is always a factor. I always gain weight during periods of high stress. Whether this is due to comfort eating (probably), my metabolism not working as well (my stomach problems always get a lot worse) or what, I do not know.
Now I have always had an active job. My jobs have always entailed moving around constantly and lifting things. So, a seditary job has never been the problem.
My family is genetically geared toward being heavy though, and we did always skip breakfast growing up.
If I were beting on one factor, I would bet on genetics however . ..
__________________
***********************
If you weren't born drop dead gorgeous, be thankful for the opportunity to develop character first.
My biggest struggle... Turns out I need to monitor my calorie intake, too.
It still seems to be better for me than 4-5 smaller feedings and it sure takes the cooking/packing food pressure off.
I've added in the "skip breakfast" strategy to the PSMF diet (which is currently in week 3) and it's working wonders.
I get up to have my coffee + stimulants, do a little 20-30 minute walk a few times a week, and put off my first meal til noon-1pm
From there it's a breeze just sticking to protein + veggies. Sticking meals in between 1-10pm is much more filling than trying to space them out between 8am-10pm.
When it's time to go back to "regular" eating I'm going to stick w/ the same strategy, just adding more carbs/fats in with each meal.
But yeah, you definitely have to stay on top of the kcal intake one way or another.
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What is it about eating a reasonable breakfast that contributes to a healthy body weight?
Off the cuff, I'd say satiety. People that eat even a modest breakfast are going to stay full and ultimately control hunger better, on average, than those who don't.
Intermittent fasting is something of an outlier, in that people using it are generally cognizant of what they're doing and have some coping strategy or another. That won't necessarily apply to the general public, who will just starve all day then go sit on the couch knocking back high-calorie food.
Low energy output + (relatively) high energy intake = obesity
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Does eating breakfast just naturally lead to an overall healthier intake of calories? Does it influence the metabolism? Does not eating breakfast lead to binging either because of increased hunger later in the day, or the perception that 'I didn't eat breakfast so I can have this treat'? Does not eating until later in the day lead to changes in cravings for less healthy foods? How does all this tie together?
D) All of the above, to some degree or another.
The metabolic influence of feeding is pretty drastically overstated (i.e., doesn't really matter when kcal intake is controlled for), but it can have effects on satiety/fullness.
And yeah there are psychological/behavioral factors involved as well, which are the #1 culprit in most cases. Some of it is pure habit or lack of education, while some of it is physiologically-triggered.
Regulation of energy intake and body mass is a pretty complex issue in the body.
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That's a lot different than just doing it out of habit or to save calories for later. I don't know if that makes sense?
Ya, it does and it's pretty spot on.
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I've added in the "skip breakfast" strategy to the PSMF diet (which is currently in week 3) and it's working wonders.
I get up to have my coffee + stimulants, do a little 20-30 minute walk a few times a week, and put off my first meal til noon-1pm
From there it's a breeze just sticking to protein + veggies. Sticking meals in between 1-10pm is much more filling than trying to space them out between 8am-10pm.
When it's time to go back to "regular" eating I'm going to stick w/ the same strategy, just adding more carbs/fats in with each meal.
But yeah, you definitely have to stay on top of the kcal intake one way or another.
Well, as of this weekend, I'm actually on a plan, so we'll see how this goes. I seem to have "maintain" down pat. Let's see if I can lose a little more fat on this thing.
Originally Posted by Snarlla What is it about eating a reasonable breakfast that contributes to a healthy body weight?
Off the cuff, I'd say satiety. People that eat even a modest breakfast are going to stay full and ultimately control hunger better, on average, than those who don't.
I actually get more hungry if I do eat breakfast. Not sure why. If I don't eat between the time I get up, and say 10:00 or 11:00 I am not the least bit hungry usually and can last till 1 or 2 PM before eating. However if I get up and eat at 8:00 or 9:00 I am often ravenous by noonish. That's one of the reasons breakfast is such a hard meal for me. I can get a much better calorie deficit if I skip breakfast. I haven't gone back through and analyzed my weight loss for weeks where I skipped many breakfasts though. I wonder if that would tell me anything? I had a pretty good rate of weight loss for pretty much 8 months straight though, and I know there were weeks (maybe even months) where I skipped breakfast at least 3x a week.
Doing that scares me though. It makes me feel afraid that I will slip back into my old habits.
Matt, I am doing the same thing on UD2 on my depletion days.....holding off as long as I can for that first meal. Like you, I find it much easier to eat between noon and 8pm (those are my eating hours) than starting at 7 or 8 am and trying space out those few calories.
I actually get more hungry if I do eat breakfast. Not sure why. If I don't eat between the time I get up, and say 10:00 or 11:00 I am not the least bit hungry usually and can last till 1 or 2 PM before eating. However if I get up and eat at 8:00 or 9:00 I am often ravenous by noonish. That's one of the reasons breakfast is such a hard meal for me. I can get a much better calorie deficit if I skip breakfast. I haven't gone back through and analyzed my weight loss for weeks where I skipped many breakfasts though. I wonder if that would tell me anything? I had a pretty good rate of weight loss for pretty much 8 months straight though, and I know there were weeks (maybe even months) where I skipped breakfast at least 3x a week.
Doing that scares me though. It makes me feel afraid that I will slip back into my old habits.
Are these protein breakfasts where you are hungry 3 hours later? Or higher carb breakfasts?
I remember reading this detailed article about the 'top 10' traits that obese people have in common.
According to the article, the number 1 thing that obese people have in common is that they do not eat breakfast. In fact, the article said that they don't eat until "late afternoon"
Other traits were, high sugar/carbs, seditary lifestyle, etc.
anyway, what is your thoughts on this?
I agree with it, but in a slightly different sense. Obese people are very self conscious. They often eat alone and won't eat in front of other people. When they do get on their own they would just rip it up - kind of a form of self deprivation with a reward.
It illustrates that one of the biggest obese problems is not food, but the psychology.
Either really. High protein less so than high carb, but not too much difference.
For me personally, I found that when I switched to 4-6 small meals with protein at each meal, it transformed my desires for food, my cravings, and calmed everything down for me. The protein at steady intervals has been wonderful, for me anyway. I can do one conscious ESE, and maybe when I'm in a conscious food state, I could do IF, but when I go to my "normal eating" "instinctive feelings" (historical patterns) it's late night snacking and carb cravings
I agree with it, but in a slightly different sense. Obese people are very self conscious. They often eat alone and won't eat in front of other people. When they do get on their own they would just rip it up - kind of a form of self deprivation with a reward.
It illustrates that one of the biggest obese problems is not food, but the psychology.
Hmm, I think that it illustrates that you are very good at making broad generalizations . "Obese people are very self concious"- personally... not so much. At my heaviest I wasn't really self concious. I'd wear a bathing suit, take my kids to the playground, etc... I never hid in the metaphorical closet to eat. Why would I hide when I could go to McDonald's or Red Robin and eat just like 99.9% of the rest of the customers? I did binge at night some, but I wasn't hiding, that's just where I happened to be at the time. I'm sure that there are some obese people who hide and binge, but I'd hesitate to say that it was most obese people.
And I don't really think the biggest problem is psychology either. I'm sure psychological issues are at the root for some people, but there's a lot more obesity now than there was 20-30 years ago. Did a large percentage of our population suddenly develop psychological problems? Nah, we just have an overabundance of easily accessible calories, too little movement, and too little recognition of 'normal' portions sizes and calorie intakes.
ETA: I hope this didn't come off as snarky, because I didn't mean for it to be. Thinking some more, I do agree that psychology plays a role, but not really in the sense of 'psychological problems' verging on mental disorders, like closet binge eating.
For me personally, I found that when I switched to 4-6 small meals with protein at each meal, it transformed my desires for food, my cravings, and calmed everything down for me. The protein at steady intervals has been wonderful, for me anyway. I can do one conscious ESE, and maybe when I'm in a conscious food state, I could do IF, but when I go to my "normal eating" "instinctive feelings" (historical patterns) it's late night snacking and carb cravings
That's good. I've got it pretty much under control I think. I just have to recognize that if I eat breakfast I will get hungry sooner. If I have a plan for that I'm good. If I don't eat breakfast I have to recognize that I will be able to go longer without eating, but when I do finally have my meal, and later that day, I have to be careful not to go overboard. As long as I'm tracking and paying attention the cravings seem to be pretty much under control.
Honesly, since August of last year when I began tracking food, my craving and eating habits have changed so much.
Okay, sorry to ramble about myself. Back to the original topic...
I agree with it, but in a slightly different sense. Obese people are very self conscious. They often eat alone and won't eat in front of other people. When they do get on their own they would just rip it up - kind of a form of self deprivation with a reward.
It illustrates that one of the biggest obese problems is not food, but the psychology.
This is so true, A huge eye opener for me was when I started working in an office with several lean, fit folks. I noticed they seemed to be eating all day...little bits, a small bowl of oatmeal, a non-fat yogurt. But they were eatng, and eating openly. As an obese person, I hid my eating. As if even eating normal protions of heatly food was something to be ashamed of....and then go off on my own for the HUGE fast food meal, or stuffing 4 Krispy kremes in my mouth between the drive through and the parking lot.
As to the rest of this discussion.....I'm finding more and more the 5-6 meal thing doesn't work for me either. Both from a sateity standpoint and just my lifestyle. I don't have time to plan, cook and package all that. I do best with coffee and a tiny bit of skim milk first thing. Before I go to work I cook 45g of steel cut oatmeal, mix in about a cup frozen blueberries, and carry a scoop of unflavored protein powder and 15g flaxseed meal. Around 10-ish I reheat at work, mix in the PP and flaxseed. This holds me fine until after work, when I'll have some non-fat cottage cheese before working out and cooking dinner.
My trainer keeps on the you must eat 5-6 meals thing (plus the no carbs after 5, and several other myths). I love her workouts, but the diet advice makes me cringe. Hell, I get all those myths and not a word about total calories, deficit levels, the real important things. And is a huge reason I've decided not to buy more sessions and work on my own when I return from vacation.
I've added in the "skip breakfast" strategy to the PSMF diet (which is currently in week 3) and it's working wonders.
I get up to have my coffee + stimulants, do a little 20-30 minute walk a few times a week, and put off my first meal til noon-1pm
From there it's a breeze just sticking to protein + veggies. Sticking meals in between 1-10pm is much more filling than trying to space them out between 8am-10pm.
When it's time to go back to "regular" eating I'm going to stick w/ the same strategy, just adding more carbs/fats in with each meal.
But yeah, you definitely have to stay on top of the kcal intake one way or another.
Hey Matt......how's PSMF working with 5-3-1? Are you doing them in conjunction? I just finished 7 cycles of UD2 and I am so sick of the depletion workouts...I am ready to take a break from them. However, I've still got a bit of fat loss I need to focus on, as well as a vacation looming (over Labor Day). I'm thinking of taking a maintenance break now for 2 weeks, implementing 5-3-1, and then after 2 weeks, doing PSMF/RFL right up to my vacation. I was just wondering if I could keep up the 5-3-1 during those PSMF days. Thoughts?
ETA: I would pick up with 5-3-1 after vacation, presumably. I love UD2 for the diet....it's just those damn depletion workouts that I despise. Not sure about diet after vacation.....lower carb for the most part, perhaps with a more moderate carb load each week??
No way I'm trying to pull off 531 on the fasting diet, that's guaranteed burnout and/or injury.
I just slotted two heavier strength days (OHP + DL, 2-boards + Squats) and kept the working weights around 90-95% of my bests in the last 531 cycle. If I felt good I'd go a little heavier, but I kept the total working sets to just two.
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Are you doing them in conjunction? I just finished 7 cycles of UD2 and I am so sick of the depletion workouts...I am ready to take a break from them. However, I've still got a bit of fat loss I need to focus on, as well as a vacation looming (over Labor Day). I'm thinking of taking a maintenance break now for 2 weeks, implementing 5-3-1, and then after 2 weeks, doing PSMF/RFL right up to my vacation. I was just wondering if I could keep up the 5-3-1 during those PSMF days. Thoughts?
You might could, but the problem is you really won't want to lift more than twice/week - trust me on that one. The energy won't be there to sustain teh workouts and you'll have crap recovery even if you do.
Best case scenario for PSMF is just to maintain strength. It's really not the time to try and build.
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ETA: I would pick up with 5-3-1 after vacation, presumably. I love UD2 for the diet....it's just those damn depletion workouts that I despise. Not sure about diet after vacation.....lower carb for the most part, perhaps with a more moderate carb load each week??
On a three-day schedule you could just try to focus on higher carb intake around the workout, leaving the other four days as lower-carb/lower calorie eating.
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Hey Matt......how's PSMF working with 5-3-1? Are you doing them in conjunction? I just finished 7 cycles of UD2 and I am so sick of the depletion workouts...I am ready to take a break from them. However, I've still got a bit of fat loss I need to focus on, as well as a vacation looming (over Labor Day). I'm thinking of taking a maintenance break now for 2 weeks, implementing 5-3-1, and then after 2 weeks, doing PSMF/RFL right up to my vacation. I was just wondering if I could keep up the 5-3-1 during those PSMF days. Thoughts?
ETA: I would pick up with 5-3-1 after vacation, presumably. I love UD2 for the diet....it's just those damn depletion workouts that I despise. Not sure about diet after vacation.....lower carb for the most part, perhaps with a more moderate carb load each week??
Jane, I've been doing 5-3-1 for 3 weeks on RFL (1,300 calories per day) and have maintained strength just fine. I don't expect any gains, I just do the main lifts, then the accessories with less volume. I've also opted for the 3 days per week approach. In the 3 weeks, I've lost 11.5 lbs and my waist has went from 41" to 38".
Matt, why couldn't someone use the 5-3-1 format and just cut back on volume on the accessory lifts? Maybe it's a different situation with Jane (in that she's not started yet), but if you've already done 5 cycles and are use to the format, I don't see the risk in going into maintenance mode for 1 or 2 cycles.
Do you agree with this?
. "Obese people are very self concious"- personally... not so much. At my heaviest I wasn't really self concious. I'd wear a bathing suit, take my kids to the playground, etc... I never hid in the metaphorical closet to eat. Why would I hide when I could go to McDonald's or Red Robin and eat just like 99.9% of the rest of the customers? I did binge at night some, but I wasn't hiding, that's just where I happened to be at the time. I'm sure that there are some obese people who hide and binge, but I'd hesitate to say that it was most obese people. 
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