The Fat Loss TroubleshootThis is your place to troubleshoot your fat loss problems from nutrition to training. This section is led by Leigh Peele, author of "The Fat Loss Troubleshoot," the ultimate fat loss manual. If your results have slowed or stalled this is the place to come for advice for all your fat loss needs.
I’ve been doing OPT since 9-2-08 and have lost about 12lbs. The thing is that I’ve felt like crap an awful lot and had several bouts with days-long headaches. They are the type that Advil and/or aspirin do not fix, dull the pain but it’s still there. I have had these in the past but only occasionally (every few months and about the same time in my cycle usually). As far as feeling crappy it’s kind of tied to the headaches, sort of a nauseous feeling. I’m wondering what’s causing this. The lowered calories, lowered carbs (than I’m used to), higher protein (than I’m used to), something being released as I burn off fat? I drink a lot of water other than some coffee first thing in the morning. Ideas?
Do you think that it could just be from the lower calories and carbs? It seems that some people are more sensitive to that, and I've seen Leigh say that a lot of times being in a deficit just plain sucks and you do feel crappy.
If it's too much, though, could you try adjusting your deficit so that it isn't as low or that your carbs aren't so low? Maybe see if that takes care of the problem? You won't lose as fast, but you might be able to live through it much more easily.
((hugs)) headaches suck, so I'm sorry.
oh, and whereabouts in your cycle do these usually occur--that might give a clue about what's going on. It could be hormonal imbalance or something or it could be that you're more sensitive to certain hormones than others.
__________________
"Do you choose to simply know the path, or do you choose to walk it?"
Your body keeps an accurate journal regardless of what you write down...
Do you think that it could just be from the lower calories and carbs? It seems that some people are more sensitive to that, and I've seen Leigh say that a lot of times being in a deficit just plain sucks and you do feel crappy.
If it's too much, though, could you try adjusting your deficit so that it isn't as low or that your carbs aren't so low? Maybe see if that takes care of the problem? You won't lose as fast, but you might be able to live through it much more easily.
((hugs)) headaches suck, so I'm sorry.
oh, and whereabouts in your cycle do these usually occur--that might give a clue about what's going on. It could be hormonal imbalance or something or it could be that you're more sensitive to certain hormones than others.
Well I know I can't do super low carb like an Atkins type plan it just makes me too foggy and grouchy.
The headaches (while sucky) and crappy feelings aren't enough to make me quit because the plan IS working and I'd rather suffer through them for another 6-7 weeks to lose the weight than slow the process!
It's been a while since I had one of these headaches aside from OPT but I think it was right before my period would start.
I guess I'm more curious as to their cause sort of like when you hear a strange noise that drives you crazy until you've identified it?
Thanks for the reminder "...and I've seen Leigh say that a lot of times being in a deficit just plain sucks and you do feel crappy."
I’ve been doing OPT since 9-2-08 and have lost about 12lbs. The thing is that I’ve felt like crap an awful lot and had several bouts with days-long headaches. They are the type that Advil and/or aspirin do not fix, dull the pain but it’s still there. I have had these in the past but only occasionally (every few months and about the same time in my cycle usually). As far as feeling crappy it’s kind of tied to the headaches, sort of a nauseous feeling. I’m wondering what’s causing this. The lowered calories, lowered carbs (than I’m used to), higher protein (than I’m used to), something being released as I burn off fat? I drink a lot of water other than some coffee first thing in the morning. Ideas?
Well, you've lost 2 pounds per week, everyone's dream loss... I'm not sure how much you weighed to begin with, but if it was under 180, then perhaps you're losing too fast (too much deficit as was just said). The coffee could cause headaches. Also, what is your food like? Is it unprocessed completely? Perhaps some 1 food is triggering it?
Well the carbs and the deficit is low enough for some to cause a problem but not concurrently so. I am inclined to go with a more hormonal based issues. Curious, is your nutrient intake good and are you hitting the macros?
Well, you've lost 2 pounds per week, everyone's dream loss... I'm not sure how much you weighed to begin with, but if it was under 180, then perhaps you're losing too fast (too much deficit as was just said). The coffee could cause headaches. Also, what is your food like? Is it unprocessed completely? Perhaps some 1 food is triggering it?
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Originally Posted by Leigh P.
Well the carbs and the deficit is low enough for some to cause a problem but not concurrently so. I am inclined to go with a more hormonal based issues. Curious, is your nutrient intake good and are you hitting the macros?
Started at about 172 so yeah under 180. I don’t feel as if I’m losing strength. I’m not increasing the weights I’m using but I’m not decreasing them either. Are headaches/general queasiness something that is associated with weight loss in the 2lb/week range? Why would it be too fast? I sort of thought it was fine given the idea behind the plan is get in and get done.
I’m drinking about the same amount of coffee I always have but I do agree it’s possible that could cause or at least contribute to the headaches and is something I’m watching. I only drink it in the morning and never have any other caffeinated beverages after about 9a.
I cook most (almost all) of our meals from scratch and we don’t eat out.
I’m better at hitting the calories than the macros those are tough especially getting enough protein. Prior to this plan I’ve always eaten a more a high carb diet. That said I'm getting pretty close on macros most of the time.
Two weekends ago I was at the end of week #4, a rest week, that weekend I was over both days with calories and my macros were definitely off. It had also been a rather stressful week. I had a headache all day Saturday and Sunday along with slight nausea. Last weekend I was low on calories both Friday and Sunday with macros being off on Saturday. Again the weekend long headache with slight nausea. I haven’t been tracking exactly how I feel beyond that other than knowing I feel crappier than usual or rather crappier for eating better and healthier foods. I felt like crap before when I was overeating and eating too much junk. This past week I was on target with calories and very close on macros and while I didn’t have the extended headaches there were several afternoons of nausea and some headaches. Nothing that needed Advil but noticeable.
I am curious, beyond nutrition, if it could be a muscle issue. Headaches are a varied reasoning and source. Nailing them down can be tricky. I would beyond nutrition and hydration (do think it is important) look and make sure you are overly tense or strained in the neck/shoulder/back area. A few neck and scap stretches and kept me headache free many times.
Another possibility I've been wondering about is that these headaches the OP is having are actually migraines. Not all migraines are incapacitating or debilitating especially if they start happening more frequently. I've had to learn a lot about headaches as my teenage daughter has had a chronic migraine for a year now. Anyway the reasons I'm thinking migraine are they originally happened at the same time in her cycle, not responding to advil, the nausea, and also that they are now getting worse when she made dietary changes. Off the top of my head I don't remember reading that dieting down/deficits is a common migraine trigger by itself although skipping meals can be a common trigger so I'm wondering if a deficit could be a problem for some also.
Anyway something to consider. If these headaches are migraines in my mind that opens up a whole new kettle of fish though as far as what to do about them goes. If I was in your shoes what I'd be doing about worsening migraines would be completely different than what I'd do for tension headaches. Worsening migraines I'd see a dr about but probably wouldn't go for a bout of regular headaches. If I wasn't sure if my headaches were migraines or not I'd go see a dr also. If these were tension headaches I'd buck it up as much as possible and expect it to be part of feeling crummy on a deficit. But if it was a migraine I wouldn't push through I'd cut the deficit and take the weight loss slower.
As for coffee, I'd certainly not stop drinking it.. some get withdrawal headaches from caffein abstinence which normally often happens on weekends , esp for office workers that tend to load up on coffe Mon thru Fri .
I've seen that happening frequently on a diet like South Beach or Atkins when it is encouraged to abstain from caffein.. not only did it result in headaches but also in pretty severe obstipation, which is already a problem coz' of generally lowered fiber intake but worsened due to lowered caffein.
But the previous poster is entirely correct about how headaches tend to hit on specific days of a cycle. What is interesting is also how naturally we tend to crave more carbs on those very same days...
I've been eating the South Beach way for a while and headaches and general ickyness are pretty common when you cut down on carbs. And I believe you said you went from higher to lower carbs?
The wisdom on the SB boards is to eat beans and drink milk. Especially the beans. I've tried it when cutting down on grains and it really does seem to help. I imagine it's because beans are fairly high in carbs and protein.
I did stock up on beans in preparation for starting OPT tomorrow.
Another possibility I've been wondering about is that these headaches the OP is having are actually migraines. Not all migraines are incapacitating or debilitating especially if they start happening more frequently. I've had to learn a lot about headaches as my teenage daughter has had a chronic migraine for a year now. Anyway the reasons I'm thinking migraine are they originally happened at the same time in her cycle, not responding to advil, the nausea, and also that they are now getting worse when she made dietary changes. Off the top of my head I don't remember reading that dieting down/deficits is a common migraine trigger by itself although skipping meals can be a common trigger so I'm wondering if a deficit could be a problem for some also.
Anyway something to consider. If these headaches are migraines in my mind that opens up a whole new kettle of fish though as far as what to do about them goes. If I was in your shoes what I'd be doing about worsening migraines would be completely different than what I'd do for tension headaches. Worsening migraines I'd see a dr about but probably wouldn't go for a bout of regular headaches. If I wasn't sure if my headaches were migraines or not I'd go see a dr also. If these were tension headaches I'd buck it up as much as possible and expect it to be part of feeling crummy on a deficit. But if it was a migraine I wouldn't push through I'd cut the deficit and take the weight loss slower.
Just my 2 cents.
Diana
I’ve had the same thought regarding these headaches being migraines since I first started getting them. I guess because they came so infrequently and I can function I wasn’t too worried. I have had two actual, can’t function, need to be in a dark and silent space migraines both in my mid 20’s. My mother also gets them. I should ask her if they’re still a problem and when they started since I don’t remember her having them when I was a kid.
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Originally Posted by Espi
As for coffee, I'd certainly not stop drinking it.. some get withdrawal headaches from caffein abstinence which normally often happens on weekends , esp for office workers that tend to load up on coffe Mon thru Fri .
I've seen that happening frequently on a diet like South Beach or Atkins when it is encouraged to abstain from caffein.. not only did it result in headaches but also in pretty severe obstipation, which is already a problem coz' of generally lowered fiber intake but worsened due to lowered caffein.
But the previous poster is entirely correct about how headaches tend to hit on specific days of a cycle. What is interesting is also how naturally we tend to crave more carbs on those very same days...
Yeah, I gave up coffee cold turkey once. I was laid out on the couch incapacitated for THREE days. Won’t be trying that again! The two weekends with the worst headaches bracketed my last period and the week before the first one I was in week 4 of OPT rest but low calories and 20% carbs. Very interesting.
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Originally Posted by Cola717
I've been eating the South Beach way for a while and headaches and general ickyness are pretty common when you cut down on carbs. And I believe you said you went from higher to lower carbs?
The wisdom on the SB boards is to eat beans and drink milk. Especially the beans. I've tried it when cutting down on grains and it really does seem to help. I imagine it's because beans are fairly high in carbs and protein.
I did stock up on beans in preparation for starting OPT tomorrow.
Yes definitely went from higher to lower carbs, probably 60-80% carbs with significantly higher calories than now. Beans and milk. Interesting. I’ve been so focused on meat, cottage cheese and protein powder (don’t like eggs) to get in enough protein. I’d also been skipping the beans because of their high carb content. Hmmm…meals might look a little different around here this week.
That explains just about everything, there's very few people eating 80% carbs... the average (Dutch/European?) population tends to eat at a ratio of 45%C-15%P-40%F I'm told, so for an average person low-carbing isn't such a dramatic change.
I hope that you can find the solution to the headaches. I get migranes, too, and they are only rarely completely incapacitating for me (or I'm only rarely allowed to completely indulge in being incapacitated, maybe). One thing to do would be to track things really closely--your physical symptoms as well as your foods. You might be able to find something that's a trigger for you. I'm really sensitive to strong smells (I can't even go near Bath and Body Works, for example; just walking past it in the mall can trigger a migrane). I've also got to be really careful about wearing my glasses and sunglasses so that I don't spend too much time squinting to see.
Good luck!
__________________
"Do you choose to simply know the path, or do you choose to walk it?"
Your body keeps an accurate journal regardless of what you write down...
That explains just about everything, there's very few people eating 80% carbs... the average (Dutch/European?) population tends to eat at a ratio of 45%C-15%P-40%F I'm told, so for an average person low-carbing isn't such a dramatic change.
If you toss in fat free candy and other low fat junk food it’s pretty easy to raise the carbs and lower the fat. 15% protein sounds about right for me in the past. No wonder I’m trying to lose weight!
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Originally Posted by maggieandmommy
I hope that you can find the solution to the headaches. I get migranes, too, and they are only rarely completely incapacitating for me (or I'm only rarely allowed to completely indulge in being incapacitated, maybe).
My husband accuses me of being insensitive when he’s sick. What he doesn’t seem to realize (even after 20 years) is that I don’t usually have the luxury of lying around having him or the kids wait on me. I still have to get dinner on the table, get the kids to their activities, go to work, get the house work done, remind the three of them to take what they need for the day etc. So indulging isn’t usually an option no matter how I feel.
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Originally Posted by maggieandmommy
I've also got to be really careful about wearing my glasses and sunglasses so that I don't spend too much time squinting to see.
Good luck!
I wear sunglasses year round just for this reason!
I’ve got the day off today so once my workout is done I’m going to spend a little time writing down what information I have so far to start keeping better track of what’s going on. I’ve been thinking about doing this for my sleep habits too. I’m another one who has sleep issues.
If you toss in fat free candy and other low fat junk food it’s pretty easy to raise the carbs and lower the fat. 15% protein sounds about right for me in the past. No wonder I’m trying to lose weight!
I'm pretty sure you've reduced or eliminated the candy at this point, but just in case you (or someone else reading) didn't already know - my H and son can't touch anything with artificial sweeteners (like f/f candy) because it's a major headache/migraine trigger for them (along with squinting - my 12 year old son has transitions lenses in his regular glasses so he never "forgets" his sunglasses )...
I'm pretty sure you've reduced or eliminated the candy at this point, but just in case you (or someone else reading) didn't already know - my H and son can't touch anything with artificial sweeteners (like f/f candy) because it's a major headache/migraine trigger for them (along with squinting - my 12 year old son has transitions lenses in his regular glasses so he never "forgets" his sunglasses )...
Also a good point about artificial sweeteners. Candy is all but gone now, some gum and a mint or two occasionally. However, I have been mixing sugar free jello pudding mix with cottage cheese (can't stand it plain) as a mid-afternoon treat/meal/protein boost. In addition the protein powder I'm using has acesulfame potassium and sucralose. I'm not sure if the last two would have an affect but given that I don't usually use artificial sweeteners maybe.
More things to keep an eye on and switch out.
Everyone's thoughts and ideas have been very helpful, thank you.
I can't have artificial sweetners around the time of my period - especially Aspartame. I get wicked achey. I first noticed the sensitivity to artificial sweetners when I was eat Cottage Cheese whipped together with SF Pudding.
__________________ It all starts with the mind, but the thoughts, the intention aren't enough. Action needs to come next. Dream it, believe it, plan it, execute it, celebrate it. - Wendy
Yeah, but the issue was that she used to eat tons of candy and now is abstaining and... has wicked headaches. These is just plain & simple a carb-withdrawal headaches.. nothing to do with additives and so on.. though of course it's a valid observation that some people can't deal with additives w/o getting headaches.
All the headaches and crappy feelings are called Induction Flu by Atkins devotees...
I wear sunglasses year round just for this reason!
I bet you have light colored eyes like I do. I even wear sunglasses when it's raining because I just can't handle the bright white sky. My hubby thinks I'm nuts, but he's got dark dark brown eyes and rarely ever needs sunglasses. Have you had your eyes checked lately? I was amazed at the reduction in my headaches when I got glasses. (Apparently I was half-blind and squinting all the time! Go figure! lol)
__________________
"Do you choose to simply know the path, or do you choose to walk it?"
Your body keeps an accurate journal regardless of what you write down...
Count me among those who get headaches from artificial sweeteners ... something to consider.
I also think Leigh's suggestion bears investigation. As a physical therapist, I have treated many many people with chronic headaches. Many of those are caused by trigger points in the upper traps, sternocleidomastoid, levator, etc. Lie on your back and dig around in your neck and upper shoulders and the back of your head for any tender points. If you find any, massage for 15-20 seconds and move on to the next spot. Should help ...
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Life's a Journey ... Enjoy the Ride!
I am curious, beyond nutrition, if it could be a muscle issue. Headaches are a varied reasoning and source. Nailing them down can be tricky. I would beyond nutrition and hydration (do think it is important) look and make sure you are overly tense or strained in the neck/shoulder/back area. A few neck and scap stretches and kept me headache free many times.
Regardless, hope you feel better.
Quote:
Originally Posted by UConnJulie
Count me among those who get headaches from artificial sweeteners ... something to consider.
I also think Leigh's suggestion bears investigation. As a physical therapist, I have treated many many people with chronic headaches. Many of those are caused by trigger points in the upper traps, sternocleidomastoid, levator, etc. Lie on your back and dig around in your neck and upper shoulders and the back of your head for any tender points. If you find any, massage for 15-20 seconds and move on to the next spot. Should help ...
I totally missed Leigh’s post yesterday! Thanks for chiming in Julie. I have noticed at times that my neck, traps etc feel as if they are affected by or affecting my headaches. This morning is an excellent example. I had the day off yesterday and instead of being productive I spent most of the afternoon working on a cross stitching project. Relaxing and enjoyable but perhaps a bit too much close work with my head bent down. Will spend some time a little later working on stretching and massage.
Quote:
Originally Posted by maggieandmommy
I bet you have light colored eyes like I do. I even wear sunglasses when it's raining because I just can't handle the bright white sky. My hubby thinks I'm nuts, but he's got dark dark brown eyes and rarely ever needs sunglasses. Have you had your eyes checked lately? I was amazed at the reduction in my headaches when I got glasses. (Apparently I was half-blind and squinting all the time! Go figure! lol)
Ha, I do have a couple of inexpensive readers for doing needlework or reading in bed (can’t hold the book far enough from my face when I’m lying down!). Actually my eyes are brown though perhaps on the light side. I don’t go so far as wearing sunglasses when it’s raining but I will if it’s overcast and bright especially if I’m driving. I keep them hanging next to my keys and a back up pair in each of our vehicles!
Now I just need some ideas for cottage cheese that doesn’t involve the sugar free pudding but hides the flavor!
Now I just need some ideas for cottage cheese that doesn’t involve the sugar free pudding but hides the flavor!
Cayenne pepper?
Or if you don't like spicy-hot, look through your spice cabinet for spices you'd like to experiment with.
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"Time and patience are the 2 elements that most people don't include in their plans."
-Alan Aragon
"The scale simply tells you how much the earth loves you on a particular day."
-Ogedei (Keith)
Losing weight, headaches, feeling crappy…
I was laid out on the couch incapacitated for THREE days. Won’t be trying that again! The two weekends with the worst headaches bracketed my last period and the week before the first one I was in week 4 of OPT rest but low calories and 20% carbs. Very interesting. 
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