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While it is perfectly legal to consume beer (if born before this date in 1983), I am not here to convince you to do so.
But medical evidence is mounting that moderate beer consumption — one to two beers daily — does a body good.
However, if you are a male be careful. beer or the hops part appears to increase estrogen levels.Darn.
• Researchers at Oregon State University are looking into the estrogenic properties of hops for hormone replacement therapy for post-menopausal women. They say it is the strongest estrogenic phytochemical ever discovered, far more potent than soy.
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Doesn\'t cross training sound like something Jesus could have benefited from?
Originally posted by dinabol: • Researchers at Oregon State University are looking into the estrogenic properties of hops for hormone replacement therapy for post-menopausal women. They say it is the strongest estrogenic phytochemical ever discovered, far more potent than soy.
Once again, for every study you can show...um, pull off of t-mag showing the purported estrongenic effects of soy on rats, I'll pull one that shows the opposite. Soy contains a weak plant phytoestrogen that occupies the estrogenic receptor (in both men and women). Because of this, it is recommended for women suffering through menopausal symptoms because it occupies empty receptors available due to declining estrogen levels. It has even been argued that consumption of soy INCREASES the ratio of testosterone to estrogen in men, precisely because it's weak plant phytoestrogen fills the receptor instead of the more potent human estrogen.
Finally, the Japanese and Chinese eat more soy in their diet than any western country's inhabitants, and have historically. They still continue to reproduce and the men don't suffer from gynocomastia or low sperm count.
Originally posted by dinabol: Water, grains, hops and yeast.
That’s all beer is — simple and natural.
While it is perfectly legal to consume beer (if born before this date in 1983), I am not here to convince you to do so.
But medical evidence is mounting that moderate beer consumption — one to two beers daily — does a body good.
However, if you are a male be careful. beer or the hops part appears to increase estrogen levels.Darn.
• Researchers at Oregon State University are looking into the estrogenic properties of hops for hormone replacement therapy for post-menopausal women. They say it is the strongest estrogenic phytochemical ever discovered, far more potent than soy.
...then there's that one small ingedient you left out....ALCOHOL
My point above was to say that while certain plant based foods and their derivatives (wine, soy, beer) may have effects on estrogen receptors (filling them), that is a far cry from saying that they have the same effect as estrogen. There's a large, and illogical leap when making that analogy. An equivalent mis-step in logic would be saying that any of the serotonin reuptake inhibitors that help alleviate depression (e.g. Prozac, Cirpamil) serve the same function as serotonin.
At least I think my SRRI analogy to the analogy is correct... Maybe the analogy fails in it's analogy to the initial analogy.
Effects of Alcohol Use and Estrogen on Bone
Russell T. Turner, Ph.D., and Jean D. Sibonga, Ph.D.
Russell T. Turner, Ph.D., is a consultant in the Department of Orthopedics, Mayo Clinic, professor of Orthopedics, and associate professor of Biochemistry and Molecular Biology at the Mayo Medical School, Rochester, Minnesota.
Jean D. Sibonga, Ph.D., is an assistant professor in the Department of Orthopedics, Mayo Clinic, Rochester, Minnesota.
This work was supported by National Institutes of Health Grant AA–11140; Department of Defense Grant, DAMD 17–98-1–8517; and the Mayo Clinic, Rochester, Minnesota.
In marked contrast with men who drink, women who drink alcohol are found, as a group, to have higher bone mass compared with women who abstain. Furthermore, the apparent beneficial effects of alcohol use are more apparent in postmenopausal women than women of reproductive age, suggesting that there might be an interaction between alcohol and estrogen. Estrogen deficiency accompanying menopause leads to bone loss, which in turn predisposes women to osteoporosis later in life. Estrogen deficiency accelerates bone remodeling, which is the process by which small areas of bone are destroyed and rebuilt, and leads to an imbalance whereby bone resorption-the part of remodeling consisting of breaking down and assimilating-exceeds bone formation. Alcohol might reduce bone loss in postmenopausal women by increasing the circulating levels of estrogen. Alternatively, alcohol might slow bone loss by acting on bone cells to reduce bone remodeling. Alcohol use has a negative effect on the immature skeleton but current understanding suggests that small quantities of alcohol may have beneficial effects on bone in older women. Key words: chronic AODE (effects of alcohol or other drug use, abuse, and dependence); estrogens; osteoporosis; risk factors; bone fracture; bone resorption; bone mass density; beneficial vs. adverse drug effect; biological repair
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Doesn\'t cross training sound like something Jesus could have benefited from?
You have to hope that this study is flawed, but the evidence seems irrefutable.
Yesterday scientists for Health Canada suggested that, considering the results of a recent analysis that revealed the presence of female hormones in beer, men should take a long hard look at their beer consumption. The theory is that drinking beer makes men turn into women.
To test the theory, 100 men were fed 6 pints of beer each within a one hour period. It was then observed that 100% of the men gained weight, talked excessively without making sense, became overly emotional, couldn't drive, failed to think rationally, argued over nothing, had to sit down while urinating, couldn't perform sexually, and refused to apologize when wrong.
Problems:
1) You have cited an abstract. Can't determine anything from that because...
2) the word 'might' is used a lot in there. That means they were unable to come to a determination on what was potentially slowing bone loss. There is no summary conclusion the authors have reached, which tends to show they have info for further research, but not much else.
3) Without numbers, we have no idea if the results (which we also have no idea of since they are not listed) are statistically valid.
4) Even with their hypothesis, there are two different actions proposed as being causal. It is evident from the abstract that the researchers only suspect, but do not know, the prime cause.
True, but if you do some research into it. I did only out of boredom I was astonished at a number of different studies all making the same conclusions. OH well i'll just drink liquor then.
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Doesn\'t cross training sound like something Jesus could have benefited from?
Originally posted by Wired: You have to hope that this study is flawed, but the evidence seems irrefutable.
Yesterday scientists for Health Canada suggested that, considering the results of a recent analysis that revealed the presence of female hormones in beer, men should take a long hard look at their beer consumption. The theory is that drinking beer makes men turn into women.
To test the theory, 100 men were fed 6 pints of beer each within a one hour period. It was then observed that 100% of the men gained weight, talked excessively without making sense, became overly emotional, couldn't drive, failed to think rationally, argued over nothing, had to sit down while urinating, couldn't perform sexually, and refused to apologize when wrong.
Kaiser, I don't have the time now, but I'm pretty sure I've read that due to the amount of soy that is put into our food now the avg western male eats much more soy than the avg Japanese or Chinese male.
(Maybe from John's article about our ancestor's diets?)
Everything in moderation. A beer/day isn't going to hurt you no matter what the studies show. The low dose alcohol each day has been shown in many studies to be very beneficial health wise. Although, if you're really looking for the most bang for your alcohol buck red wine seems to be the way to go.
The problems start when you look at how most americans drink - binge in excess. At this point estrogen levels should be the least of someone's worries considering all the liver damage they're doing.
On the asian thing. I'm only 6'2" or so and when I was Tokyo I easily towered over almost every other person on the train and around town. Just something to think about when you're thinking about being more like asians
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Maybe the analogy fails in it's analogy to the initial analogy.
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