Confusion: Bulking/Cutting vs. Both at the same time

[Noog]

I understand the concept of bulking and cutting but, I have a question about doing both at the same time. Let's say by experimentation I found my maintenance (including lifting and cardio) to be 2,500 kcals a day.

1. If my scale weight remained the same wouldn't I be gaining muscle and losing fat at the same time since I am lifting, doing cardio and eating the proper macros? Is it really possible to not gain any muscle and keep the same fat% with all that in order?

2. If so, how do I lower my BF% while staying at the same weight?

Thanks for any help.

[Lost Dog]

own bodies don't convert body fat to muscle. Fat has to be lost in a deficit period and muscle has to be gained in a surplus period. If you are eating at maint, then the periods of deficit and surplus are there (between meals, deficit and just after a meal, surplus), but not for long and not typically big enough to do much quickly.

This is why you can see people at the gym who look the same, year after year. There might be slight, slow, and subtle changes, but not dramatic. If you want quick results, pick a goal of fat loss or muscle gain and shoot for that. If you are a newbie, then you might be surprised with muscle gains while you are dropping fat, but you just can't count on it.

[sevenfootgrin]

that's related to my situation. I'm very skinny in the legs and arms, but i have a belly and man-boobs. So, I need to add muscle but at the same time drop fat. do I do the "high weight at low reps" thing to add bulk or focus more on cardio to target fat burning? or is this not even accurate at all?

[chaddukes]

Whether you decide to add mass or to lose fat first is up to you. But, its not typical to expect to do both at the same time. Thats why Lost Dog says to pick one and stick with it. To lose the fat you need to focus on diet and exercise to create a calorie deficit (burning more than consuming). To add mass you need a small surplus of calories. As a newbie you'll likely be able to get results in both areas for a short time. But, focusing on both at the same time isn't going to lead to long term success for most people.

[Lost Dog]

The big question here is how new to lifting you are. To anyone. If you're considered a "newbie" to lifting, then lots of "rules" go out the window.

Getting on a lifting program (Built for Show, NROL, etc.) and eating to lose fat is important. When you are a newbie and living a typical western lifestyle (mostly inactive and/or no hard strength work, life farming, lumberjack, labor, etc.), you have muscle mass that's probably underdeveloped. Once you're on a program, that can "fill in." Caloric deficit or not. As a result, you may not lose as much scale weight as you'd think over time, but fat goes and muscle comes.

This effect could last for months or maybe a year? You guys are both talking about fine tuning, but we can't know what to fine tune until you get in there for a while.

Train and eat right for some fat loss and see what happens in a month or more. You might be surprised how things start to work out.

[chaddukes]

I've been dieting (with planned breaks) for 18 months now. I've been lifting for about 9 months. I'm still making gains in strength to this day even having lost over 30 pounds in those last nine months. I have gained some muscle mass as well, but I don't really know how much....a pound, two.....maybe three? Who knows.

Based on my experience I would advise anyone who is new and wants to "lose the fat, and gain some muscle" to actually focus hard on the fatloss with your diet and follow a smart weight lifting plan. You might not gain tons of muscle, but you'll look a million times better. And I'm convinced that if I focused solely on muscle gain and strength that I wouldn't have gained that much more muscle mass than I already have, but wouldn't have lost nearly the same amount of fat....if any.

So, I say take advantage of your newbie condition and lose the fat while lifting heavy. Milk it for what it's worth. It's the only time in your life that you can do both!

[LiFeIsGoOd]

Lost Dog is right that normally you have to chose to either lose fat or gain muscle. However, it is possible to recomp by eating at maintenance, meaning doing both at the same time. It's pretty damn hard to do though, as far as I know.

[ericw]

i find that works best for me is choosing one of the two and go at it full-on. i focused on strength/weight maintenance over the summer "shirtless" months as once i discovered i had abs...i didn't want to see them go.....NOW i have just begun to pack in the calories and am hitting the gym with muscle gains as a goal. I know that i will also be hosting some fat gains...but i am covered w/ clothes over the winter months (i could use that extra insulation here in upstate ny too!) come april, I will start leaning out again and see what I find underneath!