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Hey all, I'm here to take opinions about 2 subjects: A) Counting vs No Counting. B) Clean vs Dirty Eating. This topics are related to me.
First off, a little about myself. I'm skinny, like 60 kg skinny I stand at 172 cm and I'm 20 years old. And weak as well. As for training I'll be doing Rip's Starting Strength routine. Now, on to my topics.
A) Counting vs No Counting:
I guess the topic is obvious. Considering I have school and I'm averaging about 20 hours / semester. It would seem like a hassle to count calories but if it's necessary, I'll try and do it.
B) Clean vs Dirty eating:
Now this is mainly the topic I wanted to ask about. See, I want to gain weight, mostly muscle. Now I'm not active, I usually sit on my computer or study. My activity is weight training 3x/week. I also don't eat except like..2 meals a day. When people tell me to "JUST EAT!!!" that kind of freaks me out. I don't wanna get fat, and eating KFC and McDonald's and that sort of food and just try to stuff myself with food seems to do more harm than good. Also, I'm in med school, so when somone tells me to do that I start thinking "obesity, cholesterol increase, atherosclerosis, insulin spikes, diabetes etc.". So yeah, you can see my concerns. I want to get rid of this skinny body and put on some weight. But I'm still 20 years old, so when I say I wanna look good don't look at me with a "another teenager" look, tell me what's wrong with that goal along with getting stronger, performing better and being healthier.
Anyways, I'm going off point here. Anyhow, I got PN for my birthday last year and never opened it. I took a look at it and it looks cool. I just want to know what's the problem with a skinny guy wanting to gain weight while keeping body fat low using the clean eating approach?
Clean foods might be healthier, but it's excess calories that makes you gain weight(lean or fat).
Well, yeah...I know, it's the law of thermodynamics. But I still don't get why does everyone recommend that skinny people just eat. Whether it's good or bad for you.
Also, I wouldn't mind taking your point of view on point (A)
People recommend skinny people just eat because usually they are just not eating enough. The differences in body composition of eating 500cals of KFC or 500cals of grilled chicken breasts cooked in olive oil are going to be very minimal.
I dont think you need to count calories, try it for a while. If you are not putting on any muscle after a few months, you likely need to be eating more (or need better training). If the issue is that you are not eating enough, tracking intake may be useful. I know for me I almost need to track it because I have the tendency to undereat. When I am trying to gain weight (ive gained over 50lbs of weight, mostly muscle over the last few years) I stick to mostly high calorie foods such as trail mix, whole milk, good cuts of steak (not lean), whole chickens, rice, lots of fruit, potatoes etc . Some would consider it 'clean' some would not, 'clean foods' makes no sense to me anyway.
Because skinny people need to eat more of any food to gain weight, but when they try to keep it clean it's hard to eat enough calories. It's harder (and more expensive) to find "clean" foods on the go, for instance.
Most "hardgainers" think they eat a lot, but don't. They're just not hungry, and if you give them the task of eating more and making it clean, they put if off until finally they haven't eaten any more than they normally do.
The milk thing is good, because it's liquid, easy, cheap, not so filling, and would be extra calories instead of replacement calories for most people.
On the A thing. Try without counting and see. Counting sucks, but you either eat more without it, or find a way to count calories, portions, meals, something... For some people, just "trying to eat more" isn't enough. They naturally lose their appetite and end up the same.
1. Try without.
2. If that fails, schedule meals, snacks, with rules
3. If that fails, count and track for a while to set your baseline, then go back to #1 and try one more time, then go to #4.
4. If you get to 3 a secoind time, keep counting until you're gaining the weight you want.
Well, yeah...I know, it's the law of thermodynamics. But I still don't get why does everyone recommend that skinny people just eat. Whether it's good or bad for you.
Most people that have such a hard time gaining weight coupled with such a strong desire to do so that they'll research it and ask how to gain weight on internet message boards usually aren't eating very much. Otherwise they wouldn't be skinny. That's why people always say to eat more.
Eat as clean as you want, so long as it's twice as much as you eat now since you've added strength training to your life.
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Since most of your life is already complicated, why make your training the same way? Jim Wendler
Ok, I get what you guys are saying. Just eat more. I'll give it a shot without counting calories for 2 weeks then I'll see where I end up.
Btw, when I'm talking about clean eating I'm not talking about only greens and fruits and lean meats and that stuff. I mean more home cooked meals rather than drive-thrus. Just wanted to clear that up.
Eh, that's pretty easy. Cook in fat, not pam; use full fat milk/cheese/etc; don't get lean meat; eat the whole egg; add butter to your veggies; use cream sauces; drink juice; have dessert.
*shrug*
2 weeks prolly isn't gonna let you see much results, but if you are conscious of what you're eating now and ensure you're really eating more and sneaking in extra cals, you'll be on the right track without counting.
I eat fast food all the time. A burger from fast food and a burger at home is about the same thing for most people. Sure, you can get whole wheat buns at home, but most people's home mayo isn't any better than Burger King's. A burrito made at home is about the same as the one you get at a restaurant, ingredient wise.
If your choice is grass fed beef, grass fed cow cheese, organic tomato, olive oil mayo, and sprouted grain buns vs Jack in the Box, your choice is clear, but people have an idea that fast food is fake beef or that there are a ton of additives in the meat. Not so. Frozen meat doesn't need preservatives and frozen meat is just as healthy as the stuff you make at home. The buns that most people eat at home are virtually the same as the fast food buns from a health perspective.
Fast food is bad because people eat too much food, and a good portion of it is fast food. Because it's cheap and convenient, fast food gets the blame.
hmmm....that gave me some food for thought. But mostly my lunches are grilled chicken or oven cooked fish and that sort with some sort of rice and veggies. I'd take that over fast food anytime.
EDIT: I also eat beef. I also eat some of my meats fried but for the most time they are grilled/cooked.
I am a hard-gainer too. When I am on a bulk and do a rest week (don't track and eat by feel), I will actually lose weight. On the cut, I will maintian or lose even on rest week. I have learned in the past two years how to eat so that I can gain weight and not gain fat. It is a reprogramming of the mind. You will most likely have to track your food to reprogram your current lifestyle and to understand how much you do actually eat. It is most likely the case that you eat much less than you think you eat.
If you cannot get that number down (how much) the WHAT of the eating is really quite insiginificant. That said it is significant in as much as eating a specific way will help you to reach your goals of hitting the calories that you need to hit. For me, adding avocados and nuts into my meal planning was a huge help. It was not a good plan for me to eat fast food because that sort of eating makes me full FOREVER. Also really high fat foods will make me full FOREVER. (If I eat Indian food, I ususally don't eat for another 24 or more hours) I am better off eating whole and fresh foods as that stimulates my appetite and makes my belly feel okay for eating again even when I am not hungry. I am also better off keeping my fat intake below a certain level in my day (usually below 70g a day for me).
And YES, even after doing this for nearly two years (2 full bulks and 1.5 cuts) I still have to force myself to eat most of the time. It is a TOTAL PIA.
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