Diet, Nutrition and SupplementationPost here for supplement reviews or nutritional advice. If you're trying to get "ripped abz" THIS is where you should be.
april 2008 - 260lbs 44 inch waist, 31% body fat. started on low carb diet by doc, started lifting 3-4 times a week, NROL and turbulence routines, occasional cheating on diet,
today 220 lbs - 37 inch waist, 26% body fat. smaller legs, chest, bigger arms. continue to workout, feel great
in all this, i've never done a workout shake, worried about low carb doc put me on. read recently that a good combo is 40gram protein/carb and 5 gram creatine for muscle build.
Beings that i'm trying to lose fat, should i add this? (doc didn't know, low carb is working to lose wt, so don't want to mess that us by adding 40-80 grams of carbs a day)
or should i try 40 grams of protein, 5 grams of creatine and __?__ grams of simple carb, since i learned that you need simle carb/insulin to effectively absorb creatine. (how much carb per gram of creatine?)
Thanks! (going to cancun in january, want to lose as many inches as possible)
You can use straight whey protein for your workout shake, without the added carbs. That's what TNT recommends for plan A, which is low carb and maximum fat loss.
__________________ The trick is in what one emphasizes. We either make ourselves miserable, or we make ourselves happy. The amount of work is the same. -- Carlos Castaneda
When I was doing low carb, I did pre and post workout shakes using Nitrean (high protein shake with little to no carbs or fat). I was following TNT low carb for the first half of this year.
Thanks, i'll stick with the not addings carbs then, but what about for the creatine? research i've done says you need to take in some carbs with the creatine for your body to absorb it properly, but i wasn't able to find a specific or even guestimated amount. any idea on this?
I'm not familiar with that principle of needing carbs with creatine. Do you have a link to some of that research?
__________________ The trick is in what one emphasizes. We either make ourselves miserable, or we make ourselves happy. The amount of work is the same. -- Carlos Castaneda
Concludes Spriet, "People who are now taking creatine just to enhance weight training performance or to improve in activities that involve short, intense bouts of exercise probably won't benefit from the carbohydrate component. "But athletes taking part in combination sprinting/aerobic events such as hockey, soccer, basketball and wrestling may benefit from the effects of both creatine and carbohydrates," he adds.Editors: Penn State's Center for Sports Medicine can be reached at (814) 865-7107.
So it's not NECESSARY to have the carbs with creatine. Creatine is still absorbed without them, just not as well. And carbs+creatine can be beneficial for certain types of activities.
I'd be curious to see what Alan or Leigh has to say on the subject. I'm inclined to just say take the creatine and skip the carbs if you're dedicated to a low-carb strategy.
__________________ The trick is in what one emphasizes. We either make ourselves miserable, or we make ourselves happy. The amount of work is the same. -- Carlos Castaneda
Although the main goal of many low carbohydrate diets is to get you into a state of ketosis, I still don't see how in the long run either adding or omitting carbohydrates from your post-workout shake would do that much. If you stay in the calorie range you need to be in for your goals, eat 1g of protein per pound of bodyweight or more, and eat only quality healthy foods (protein, fruits/veggies, some dairy, eggs, nuts, fibrous carbs, etc), you will get the results you want. You shouldn't worry about details until all the basics are fully met(not questioning if you've gotten to this point yet or not). Small alterations to diet past the basics really are needed if say your 12% bodyfat and want to go down to 9%. Then, you might need to restrict this or that fruit or this or that fibrous carbohydrate in order to get lean.
Low Carb diets are good, because they do in fact accelerate fat loss because of ketosis, because on low carbohydrates you usually end up in the right calorie zone, and because many low carbohydrate foods are the "quality, healthy" food that I talked about above. Basically, in my philosophy, in the long term, if you add or omit some simple carbohydrates from your post workout, it would do nothing noticeable to your overall results (especially if you need to lose fat). The current consensus for basic workout nutrition seems to be a combination of protein and quickly absorbing carbohydrates, and this is what I'm currently adhering to. I go for ratios like 1:1, 2:1, 1:2, or 1:0 (protein/carb) and they all don't make much of a difference. This addition of carbohydrates seems to increase muscle synthesis after workouts (it has to do with a variety of factors including the need to restore glycogen stores postworkout) according to the research that's been coming out for the last few years. Also, in my opinion, if you were to add some carbohydrates to your low-carb diet, it would be best done post-workout, as your bodies useable carbohydrates are usually depleted afterward and an insulin spike is even beneficial to you. Still, in reality, if your shake has to be 250 calories, then it doesn't matter if its made up of protein alone or protein/carbohydrates.
So it's not NECESSARY to have the carbs with creatine. Creatine is still absorbed without them, just not as well. And carbs+creatine can be beneficial for certain types of activities.
I'd be curious to see what Alan or Leigh has to say on the subject. I'm inclined to just say take the creatine and skip the carbs if you're dedicated to a low-carb strategy.
Carbs at some point postworkout are a good idea, regardless of your diet strategy. This is because they're preferentially taken up by muscle tissue rather than adipose. Having carbs pre AND post is optimal. Are they needed for creatine uptake? Only if you're in a dire hurry to reach muscle creatine saturation (fully loaded). In the latter case, you may get saturated sooner when you take creatine with carbs & protein. However, if you've been on creatine for a month or more, chances are you're already at or past the 'loading' phase, and cute tactics like taking it with carbs won't make a difference.
Although the main goal of many low carbohydrate diets is to get you into a state of ketosis, I still don't see how in the long run either adding or omitting carbohydrates from your post-workout shake would do that much. If you stay in the calorie range you need to be in for your goals, eat 1g of protein per pound of bodyweight or more, and eat only quality healthy foods (protein, fruits/veggies, some dairy, eggs, nuts, fibrous carbs, etc), you will get the results you want. You shouldn't worry about details until all the basics are fully met(not questioning if you've gotten to this point yet or not). Small alterations to diet past the basics really are needed if say your 12% bodyfat and want to go down to 9%. Then, you might need to restrict this or that fruit or this or that fibrous carbohydrate in order to get lean.
Low Carb diets are good, because they do in fact accelerate fat loss because of ketosis, because on low carbohydrates you usually end up in the right calorie zone, and because many low carbohydrate foods are the "quality, healthy" food that I talked about above. Basically, in my philosophy, in the long term, if you add or omit some simple carbohydrates from your post workout, it would do nothing noticeable to your overall results (especially if you need to lose fat). The current consensus for basic workout nutrition seems to be a combination of protein and quickly absorbing carbohydrates, and this is what I'm currently adhering to. I go for ratios like 1:1, 2:1, 1:2, or 1:0 (protein/carb) and they all don't make much of a difference. This addition of carbohydrates seems to increase muscle synthesis after workouts (it has to do with a variety of factors including the need to restore glycogen stores postworkout) according to the research that's been coming out for the last few years. Also, in my opinion, if you were to add some carbohydrates to your low-carb diet, it would be best done post-workout, as your bodies useable carbohydrates are usually depleted afterward and an insulin spike is even beneficial to you. Still, in reality, if your shake has to be 250 calories, then it doesn't matter if its made up of protein alone or protein/carbohydrates.
Can you show me the scientific evidence that ketosis causes greater drops in bodyfat than non-ketosis over the long-term under protein & calorie-controlled conditions? Thanks.
Also, there's no need for quick carbs postworkout unless either 1) you neglected proper preworkout nutrition, or 2) you're an endurance athlete with multiple glycogen-depleting bouts in a single day. Otherwise, you might as well get some nutritious carbs in versus empty cals.
Carbs at some point postworkout are a good idea, regardless of your diet strategy. This is because they're preferentially taken up by muscle tissue rather than adipose. Having carbs pre AND post is optimal.
Sorry, butting in here, but I did not want to start a new thread. Can you give some ideas on what carbs to have pre and post workout? I am just starting a heavy weight training regimen, but I have been doing the low carb diet to lose weight and I am not sure what carbs are appropriate for before/after workout? Thanks so much.
Sorry, butting in here, but I did not want to start a new thread. Can you give some ideas on what carbs to have pre and post workout? I am just starting a heavy weight training regimen, but I have been doing the low carb diet to lose weight and I am not sure what carbs are appropriate for before/after workout? Thanks so much.
Honest yet highly unsexy answer: choose the carb sources you personally like. Nutrient subtype & timing are distant secondary concerns compared to nailing your total macro targets by the end of the day. I've written volumes about nutrient timing, but in the end, it's really just nitpicking at the minutia if you're not a competitive endurance-type athlete.
workout shake for a fat guy
Linear Mode
