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Old 05-22-2007, 08:51 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Do Sat. fats preferably get stored as body fat?

I've read from a couple of sources that saturated fats have a higher tendency than mono or ploy fat to be stored as bodyfat. Anyone know if this is true?

Thanks for the help.
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Old 05-22-2007, 11:17 AM   #2 (permalink)
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First off, any macronutrient can be stored as fat. I'm not a nutritional science expert by any means, but I believe that some are more readily stored as fat than others. I think (please don't quote me on this) that calories must first be broken down by the liver into glycogen, and if your glycogen stores (in the liver, muscles, and blood) are full, it is stored as fat. So maybe saturated fat is broken down into glycogen quicker than unsaturated fat? Again, a stab in the dark here, there are plenty of people on this site like Alan and Mike that can answer this I'm sure.
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Old 05-22-2007, 05:31 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ParanoidAndroid
I've read from a couple of sources that saturated fats have a higher tendency than mono or ploy fat to be stored as bodyfat. Anyone know if this is true?

Thanks for the help.
The human data on this question is a combination of vague & alloverthemap. Your best bet is regressing towards a boring balance & moderation of the various types of FA, and here's why...

There's some fairly recent research correlating n-3 and n-6 fatty acids to reduced fat cell size according to the storage depot on the body. SFA intake correlated with an increase in fat cell size and number. n-9 FAs had no significant correlation with fat cell size, but did correlate with a reduced number of fat cells. The problem with such data is that it's based on subject's self-reports, which severely limits the level control, and it was done on a post-gastric-surgical obese population. There well could be drastically different results in the non-obese/athletic/active population.

Sat fats are not created equal. They have markedly variable physiological effects from the detrimental all the way to the beneficial. Given this, it depends on which sat fats you wanna throw on the theoretical chopping block. Stearic acid, an SFA abundant in meat & milk fat, has been consistently observed to actually reduce blood platelet aggregation. This is a good thing. In contrast, trans fats have been observed to screw up your blood lipids. This is a bad thing.

Ironically, experimental research exists on healthy humans showing the least fat was oxidized on the monounsat fat dietary treatment, and the most fat oxidized on a trans fat diet. This result echoes what's been seen in rats as well. It appears that the tighter the control of the study, the less "superior" unsat fats turn out to be for any presumed effect on bodycomp compared to SFAs. Throw in the fact that a reducing SFA intake and increasing the degree of unsaturation of fatty acids reduces androstenedione, testosterone and free testosterone levels, then you have yet another wrinkle in the mix to concern yourself with.

Then you have MCTs, which are SFAs that exibit physiological behavior that's closer to CHO than fat. MCT has been hyped to death by those who sell it. But the point is that they are a type of SFA that may have some potential miniscule benefit on body comp & fat loss. I personally wouldn't spend a dime on them, but they nevertheless illustrate the fact that SFAs are a complex and highly varied groiup of compounds in terms of effect on health and bodycomp. The effects of each type of FA undoubtedly are gonna vary with the population in question, and they're gonna vary with the individual's response and individual protocol.

Not to mention, in the larger scheme of the diet, variations in degree of saturation of fat intake are probably not gonna make a damn bit of difference unless we're comparing diets that are composed predominantly of fat. so, that basically ends the discussion... Even then, we probably wouldn't see any comparable differences in the case of a calorie deficit, wherein FA saturation would make even less impact. To segue into theory, if one were concerned about maximizing test levels during a calorie deficit, he might want to specifically make sure he doesn't neglect the intake of SFA.

Ramble, ramble.. lol. Somebody get the duct tape

Last edited by Alan Aragon : 05-22-2007 at 05:47 PM.
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Old 05-22-2007, 05:41 PM   #4 (permalink)
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thanks Alan...I actually enjoy your rambling.
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Old 05-22-2007, 05:43 PM   #5 (permalink)
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as alan said does'nt matter in cal deficit as sat fat or whatever else will be oxidized

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Old 05-22-2007, 06:25 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Alan,

with regards to testosterone levels, what are we talking about here, a 1% change? or a 30% change? or who knows?

Interesting stuff.
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Old 05-22-2007, 08:54 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
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Alan,

with regards to testosterone levels, what are we talking about here, a 1% change? or a 30% change? or who knows?

Interesting stuff.
In most of the research, 40% total dietary fat has been typically compared with 20% fat, and indeed there is significantly higher T levels achieved by the 40% fat diet. Interesting that you mentioned that particular range (1 to 30%), because the reduction is right in the middle of that. One study in particular that examined the effect of reducing a 40% fat diet to 25%, in addition to increasing the ratio of PUFA:SFA. The reduced-fat phase showed a 15% reduction in T. But note that this drop was pretty easily reversed when subjects returned to their normal intake of 40% fat. To push things away from any misguided focus on percentages, I've been recommending for some time now that folks get a varied mix of fat sources from both animal & vegetable origin, and keep fat intake at 0.4-0.5g/lb target bodyweight, & you'll have your bases covered. Obviously the percentage of total calories from fat will vary according to total calories. Absolute amounts of the macros are more reliable to focus on rather than percentages.

But bear in mind, there are many dietary factors influencing T. Regardless of fat percentage, higher a higher SFA/PUFA ratio can raise T as well. Protein is another influence on T, but not in the way you'd expect. Research has also shown a consistently negative correlation between protein intake & T levels. For example, a 10% protein diet was seen to cause significantly higher T levels than a 44% protein diet, presumably because of the latter diet's inability to lower sex hormone binding globulin (SHBG) levels. Does this mean I'm gonna recommend you have 10% protein in your diet in order to support T levels? Hail no. Taken together, it all goes back to my recommendation of not sweating details that have multiple contingencies -- and might not have any meaningful impact in the larger scheme. And beyond that, everything depends depends depends.

Last edited by Alan Aragon : 05-22-2007 at 09:10 PM.
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Old 05-22-2007, 09:08 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ParanoidAndroid
thanks Alan...I actually enjoy your rambling.
Lord I was born a ramblin' maaaaaaan (let's see if Jamie can name the artist & the year).
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Old 05-22-2007, 09:25 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Wow, thanks for that Alan, interesting stuff for sure. Ive always wondered how much these things actually effect test levels. You are an encyclopedia of knowledge.
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Old 05-23-2007, 10:25 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Further add to Alan’s post

Consider sub fractions of test
Albumin bound 38%
Sex hormone binding globulin 55-60%
Freely unbound (2-5%


The bioavailable portion being non shbg bound test (available to the tissues)

Excerpt from- Possible stimuli for strength and power adaptation: acute hormonal responses Crewther 2006

Chandler et al. examined acute hormone response to exercise with cho and or Pro taken immediately after and 2 hours after exercise. Supplementation produced a reduction in total TST in the post-exercise period compared with placebo. A similar response was also observed over 3 consecutive days of exercise with cho and pro supplementation.

Not sure how much reduction was or was duration long enough to have significant effects on MPS or protein degradation

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