Low Carb Diet Issues

[CaptainSlow]

I have been posting all my questions and concerns in the sticky thread titled " "Adam's Diet" - additional explication" and I've been getting lots of help from a couple of people that frequent that thread. However I decided to post my concerns in this new thread so I don't jam it up with useless information as well as to get opinions from other people.

Here are some questions and concerns I have about following Adam's Low-Carb diet which probably apply to low car diets in general.

"Well after being on this diet for about a week I thought I might share how it's going as well as some of the concerns I have.

So far the scale says I have lost about 7 lbs but I'm guessing most of that is water weight. I am enjoying the foods I am allowed to eat and I'm usually never hungry after a meal. However, there have been some issues.

Most days I feel very weak, tired, and sometimes dizzy when I move around. This has been most apparent at the gym. I still cannot lift as much as I could before (3 sets of 8 reps of benchpress @ 225 lbs before, and now I can barely finish 3 sets of 8) and I don't have that extra reserve when I'm at the end of a set. For example, I used to be able to push out the last rep or two of my second or third rep but now I try I can't push it out no matter how much I try; it's like there's nothing left in the "tank". I would hate to have this low carb diet affect all the work I have put into the gym over the last few years (when I started going to the gym I could barely benchpress 45 lbs). I was doing some brief searches on the Net about low carb diets and some sites stated that because I do not have any carbohydrates for fuel my body is going to my muscles for fuel with means I am losing muscle mass? Is this true?

Should this type of feeling be going away soon? Will I get my strength back (i.e. not feeling weak and having nothing left in the "tank")? Is it even worth continuing this diet if my strength/muscles are being negatively affected?

There is nothing I would like more than to lose weight (255 lbs now @ 6' 3") but if it's at the cost of my health (tired, weak, dizzy) or my strength (i.e. muscles, weightlifting amount) I would rather eat the carbs."

Here's basically a sample outline of my daily menu: http://fitday.com/WebFit/PublicJourn...er=CaptainSlow

Any thoughts?

One of the posters in the sticky thread did say that sleep might be a factor. I don't get lots of sleep 6 hours and usually when this happens the next day my eyelid constantly twitches. It usually goes away but since starting this low carb diet my eyelid twitches everyday and I constantly feel sleepy and tired.

I am seeing some fat loss in this diet. My pants are fitting looser than usual around my waist. However my primary concern is that I'm losing all that muscle and strength I have built up over the years (4+) at the gym. Perhaps I should start using lower weight amounts or just tough it out for another week or so and my strength will come back.

Thank you for any advice and comments you have. Also, thanks to LostDog and ParanoidAndroid for answering my questions that I posted in the sticky thread.

[tasinquefield]

Sleep may be a factor, or maybe your body doesn't do well on low carb. Each person's body is different - some things may work, some may not. It is kind of an experiment - trying to figure out what works best for you.

Try adding a serving or two of carbs - make sure they are veges, fruits or whole grains. Maybe trying eating a little more also, your calories seem a little low. I don't know your age, but according to the harris-benedict formula your BMR is around 2350 calories, and if you use an activity factor of 1.55 (working out 3-5 times a week), you need roughly 3600 calories to maintain. I would slowly lower the calories from that 3600 (just immediately cutting can cause issues) to around 2800-3000 and go from there - if you want to count the calories.

Just an idea.

[andrew_plamondon]

Carbs are probably too low. Every couple of days, when you begin to feel drained, try to add 2-3 servings of starchy carbs. Your body's glycogen stores are being emptied by the exercises and you need to fill them from time to time. I personally ate 150g of carbs (only veggies and fruits) on off days and added oats PWO on training days and it still wasn't enough. I added 1 or 2 higher carb days in the week when I feel like I needit.

[allenkt]

Well first of all, are you trying to get to a ketogenic state? If so, your carbs may be a bit high. For most people, the body will preferentially burn carbs. But when you go on a ketogenic diet, the body begins to burn fat instead of carbs. But that transition can take a couple of weeks during which time you could feel pretty sluggish. But once you get into Ketosis you will have plenty of energy and will be just fine. There are ways to test the amount of ketones in your body but I can't think of the name of the product right now (they are kind of like the pregnancy tests in that you urinate on these sticks and it will give you the result).

If you haven't seen the FitCast yet (www.fitcast.com) go and listen to the episode with Cassandra Forsythe. Or even better, join the Fitcast insiders and listen to the most recent episode; Cass gave some excellent information about Ketogenic diets.

Things may be different though if you are just going low carb and not ketogenic and I'm sure others will chime in with some advice.

Hope that helps.

Karl

[allenkt]

Originally Posted by andrew_plamondon

Carbs are probably too low. Every couple of days, when you begin to feel drained, try to add 2-3 servings of starchy carbs. Your body's glycogen stores are being emptied by the exercises and you need to fill them from time to time. I personally ate 150g of carbs (only veggies and fruits) on off days and added oats PWO on training days and it still wasn't enough. I added 1 or 2 higher carb days in the week when I feel like I needit.

I don't know about that. I think that unless you are doing some serious endurance work or pretty intense HIT training, your glycogen stores aren't going to be depleted all that much. I typically take in somewhere between 130-170g of carbs per day and rarely go over 200g, even on my workout days. And lately I've been working out twice per day with weights in the morning and kickboxing in the evening and I'm doing fine with low carbs. And I'll be the first to admit that my fruit and veggie intake is seriously lacking but it's something I'm working on.

[CaptainSlow]

Originally Posted by allenkt

Well first of all, are you trying to get to a ketogenic state? If so, your carbs may be a bit high. For most people, the body will preferentially burn carbs. But when you go on a ketogenic diet, the body begins to burn fat instead of carbs. But that transition can take a couple of weeks during which time you could feel pretty sluggish. But once you get into Ketosis you will have plenty of energy and will be just fine. There are ways to test the amount of ketones in your body but I can't think of the name of the product right now (they are kind of like the pregnancy tests in that you urinate on these sticks and it will give you the result).

If you haven't seen the FitCast yet (www.fitcast.com) go and listen to the episode with Cassandra Forsythe. Or even better, join the Fitcast insiders and listen to the most recent episode; Cass gave some excellent information about Ketogenic diets.

Things may be different though if you are just going low carb and not ketogenic and I'm sure others will chime in with some advice.

Hope that helps.

Karl

I think the reason that my carbs are so high is because of the 60grams of straight carbohydrates I take before/during/after my workouts. I'm not sure if I should cut those out because the Adam recommends it in his diet outline (plus I bought a gigantic bucket of it).

I don't think I want to have a full ketogenic state because I workout hard (well I try to) 5 days a week and I really need the energy for it. And it's my understanding that ketogenic state diets don't allow you to do intense workouts because of the limited amounts of energy (carbs) present.

Well I am feeling sluggish all the time so I can probably tough it out for another week or two to see if there are any changes. For some reason the only real exercise that I notice my lack of strength is bench press. The other excercises I seem to have most of my strength and I can finish but the last reps on my last sets I'm usually really tapped out and find it hard to finish the last few reps.

[tasinquefield]

I don't he's trying to go into a ketogenic state - Adam's diet is not a ketogenic diet, at least I don't see it as that. I just limits carbs to one serving a day, that's all. The rest from fruits and vegetables. I think he may just need a few more carbs - as that is possibly what his body needs. Some people have a better tolerance for carbs and can lose weight with higher carbs diets, and some need more to work out (I have a difficult time working out and eating ultra-low carb).

[Lost Dog]

Personally, I think the desire to add more carbs is just that: a desire.

We have grown up eating carbs, and we miss them. Combine this desire to eat them, with the good feeling that we get from eating them (there's a hormonal response, remember), with the temporary sluggish feeling that we get as our bodies adapt, and we've convinced ourselves that we've got to add some carbs back in.

Do we need more carbs, or just want more carbs? We don't need these carbs at all. Starchy carbs, grains, legumes, and sugars are purely optional in our diets. But, once you've been living on them, they don't seem so optional.

Physiological and psychological changes take place when we change our diets. Takes time to adapt.

We can have plenty of energy from high carb, low carb, ketogenic, or middle of the road carb diets. In fact, after a while, you really wouldn't need those workout nutrition drinks in Adam's Diet, either. But, I said "need." They are still valuable, even though you don't actually need them. They won't hurt your fat loss efforts. They'll help you recover more than if you just had protein.

[andrew_plamondon]

Originally Posted by Lost Dog

Personally, I think the desire to add more carbs is just that: a desire.

We have grown up eating carbs, and we miss them. Combine this desire to eat them, with the good feeling that we get from eating them (there's a hormonal response, remember), with the temporary sluggish feeling that we get as our bodies adapt, and we've convinced ourselves that we've got to add some carbs back in.

Do we need more carbs, or just want more carbs? We don't need these carbs at all. Starchy carbs, grains, legumes, and sugars are purely optional in our diets. But, once you've been living on them, they don't seem so optional.

Physiological and psychological changes take place when we change our diets. Takes time to adapt.

We can have plenty of energy from high carb, low carb, ketogenic, or middle of the road carb diets. In fact, after a while, you really wouldn't need those workout nutrition drinks in Adam's Diet, either. But, I said "need." They are still valuable, even though you don't actually need them. They won't hurt your fat loss efforts. They'll help you recover more than if you just had protein.

Well, I agree that we are used to eating lots of unnecessary carbs but we also have to listen to our body sometimes. I had blood tests which kinda supported the feeling that I had. It's quite logical to go low-carbish during some time (100-200g) but we have to refill our glycogen stores from time to time since our body still relies on glucose. It's a matter of trial and error to find our own sweet spot. Some can get it in the form of a cheat meal but since it becomes a binge meal or a cheat day for many people, I prefer to plan it out our get a "normal" meal in a restaurant that I like but keep it clean (it's usually salad, lamb and 1/2 to a cup of rice).

[ParanoidAndroid]

I think LD is right. You just have to get used to it. I've done low-carb before and I felt great after a couple of days.

I know this may not be the answer you want to hear, but tough it out and you'll feel better.

[andrew_plamondon]

Originally Posted by ParanoidAndroid

I think LD is right. You just have to get used to it. I've done low-carb before and I felt great after a couple of days.

I know this may not be the answer you want to hear, but tough it out and you'll feel better.

As I said, saying that something should work for everyone isn't sensible. I didn't feel that bad at all but my bloodwork was awful which is kinda strange considering that I eat fish, lean meat, tofu, veggies, fruits and oats on training days, no drinking and I'm somewhat active.

[ParanoidAndroid]

Originally Posted by andrew_plamondon

As I said, saying that something should work for everyone isn't sensible. I didn't feel that bad at all but my bloodwork was awful which is kinda strange considering that I eat fish, lean meat, tofu, veggies, fruits and oats on training days, no drinking and I'm somewhat active.

does everything work for everybody?

No, of course not.

But you have to test something out first for a period of time before declaring it bad. If the OP felt like crap after another week or so, I would agree with you to add more carbs in.

[allenkt]

Originally Posted by andrew_plamondon

As I said, saying that something should work for everyone isn't sensible. I didn't feel that bad at all but my bloodwork was awful which is kinda strange considering that I eat fish, lean meat, tofu, veggies, fruits and oats on training days, no drinking and I'm somewhat active.

What did you get tested when you had your bloodwork done? Was it a lipid profile or a full metabolic workup? And what were the results?

[andrew_plamondon]

Ah, I didn't see that he was eating this for only a week. I'd give it a 2-4 weeks before assessing.

[tasinquefield]

Actually, you do need carbs to build muscle. Try bulking without carbs and see how it goes.

Not everyone is the same. Some people need more carbs than others - i.e. they feel better, are more energetic, and have an easier time losing weight than eating low carb. I eat 150-200g of carbs a day, and I tend to do better on that versus eating 50g carbs a day. It is all about how your body reacts to different foods, different macronutrients, etc.

[Lost Dog]

You do need carbs (or at least an insulin response) to build muscle. But carrots, green beans, lettuce, spinach, apples, bananas, etc. are all filled with carbs. They're just not to the levels that we are used to.

Live at a low carb level for a while and it takes very few carbs to get an insulin response to help build muscle mass.

Most of us have heard of insulin resistance, right? You could say that EVERYONE has a constant level of insulin resistance, depending on their health and average carb intakes.

If one goes very low carb for a long time, they become more insulin sensative. At that point, the insulin response from an apple or a big ol' salad will be enough to provide the anabolic environment to build muscle.

Granted, you'd do better at building muscle at a higher level of carbs, but we're talking about needs here.

Red meat also provides a decent insulin reponse, even without carbs. So, low carbers might be able to put on some muscle with red meat and fiberous veggies, pwo. Just a theory...

However, the assumed lower insulin response at this state, a slow bulk might be better than a serious heavy bulking effort.

We confuse what we need with what works best. If you're trying to lose fat, I'd say carbs are totally optional.

[RobLL]

Your body will get whatever glucose (or equivalent) it needs one way or another. I have some blood glucose anomalies and have started checking my BG a few times a day. I stay moderately high no matter how little carbs I eat.

Your body can convert protein, but not fat, to a blood sugar. And if you don't eat enough protein it will start using your muscles.

All of this is one of the bugaboos with type two diabetes. Some people cannot control it without meds, no matter how low they go with carbs, their liver (I understand) just manufactures and pumps out sugars.

I never have high blood sugar levels, on the basis of my testing, but I also never have normal blood sugar levels. I always sit about 15-20 points higher than desirable.