Creatine use: Loading vs non-loading

Ogedei · 09-08-2006, 10:36 PM

So I started taking creatine recently. I haven't done any loading, just a straight dose per day.

I have read that loading isn't necessary.

Can someone point me to some articles on this topic, or their own expriences?

Hmmm Maybe I shoulda posted this in supplements....Feel free to move it oh great god like moderators for JPfitness land!

Thanks,

Og.

Alcoholiday · 09-08-2006, 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ogedei

So I started taking creatine recently. I haven't done any loading, just a straight dose per day.

I have read that loading isn't necessary.

Can someone point me to some articles on this topic, or their own expriences?

Hmmm Maybe I shoulda posted this in supplements....Feel free to move it oh great god like moderators for JPfitness land!

Thanks,

Og.

it doesn't matter. i don't have studies on hand though

Lisa~ · 09-09-2006, 06:53 AM

Here's an article that pretty much covers the gamut of creatine questions.
Creatine Loading Strategies

Here's the pertinent paragraph about loading.

Quote:

Dr. Hultman and coworkers employed several strategies, including a rapid protocol involving 6 days of creatine supplementation at a rate of 20 g/day, and a slower protocol with supplementation for 28 days at a rate of 3 g/day.(4) Following the rapid protocol, they also studied a maintenance dose of 2 g/day for 28 days. Both the rapid and slow protocols produced similar findings, about a 20% increase in muscle total creatine concentration. The elevated muscle total creatine concentration was maintained when supplementation was continued at a rate of 2 g/day.

Here's an article Will Brink wrote for Life Extension about the benefits of creatine supplementation. He doesn't discuss loading in particular, but I thought you might find the article relevant.
Creatine: More than a sports nutrition supplement

Craig · 09-09-2006, 01:59 PM

I don't understand why someone wouldn't load creatine.

Lost Dog · 09-09-2006, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Craig

I don't understand why someone wouldn't load creatine.

Because a lot of loading recommendations include huge amounts of sugary drinks, like grape juice, several times per day, for quite a while. Not many people really want to do that.

Seems like a decent strategy for loading would just be to take quite a bit more than maintenence levels when you have the opportunities (pwo drinks, that carby breakfast, etc.), throughout the days. Might not reach tops as quickly, but you also won't get so fat from all that sugary juice.

Cynic · 09-09-2006, 02:36 PM

I read an article within the last two years that said the body can only process about 3g at a time. I think the article said per day, but that doesn't make sense that the body can only process 3g of creatine per day but 100s of grams of protein per day. I'm not sure how valid it is and I haven't changed my 5g/day loading scheme.

Bodhi · 09-09-2006, 02:46 PM

I have gone off and on Creatine, but when I am going on it I have taken it 3 times a day for the first 4-5 days and then once a day after that.
I usually just put it in straight water and drink it fast. It doesn't taste great, but a long time ago I thought I read somthing about how some juices will reduce the affects of it if they are mixed. I am not sure this is true anymore, but it also means that I don't take in the sugar of some drinks.
Be sure to let us know the results you see from it. Thanks.

jvernacchio · 09-09-2006, 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cynic

I read an article within the last two years that said the body can only process about 3g at a time. I think the article said per day, but that doesn't make sense that the body can only process 3g of creatine per day but 100s of grams of protein per day. I'm not sure how valid it is and I haven't changed my 5g/day loading scheme.

I have read a few articles like that. Your body can only absorb so much per day so loading isn't going to get you any more gains then taking a normal dose.

Alcoholiday · 09-09-2006, 11:52 PM

i have a question.

i thought JB said it was ok to put in green tea? If you're not having sugars, then isn't ok to take it without sugary drinks?

Jimmy Smith · 09-10-2006, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alcoholiday

i have a question.

i thought JB said it was ok to put in green tea? If you're not having sugars, then isn't ok to take it without sugary drinks?

Yes, your post workout shake, or if you just go with a protein shake and a meal will cause an insulin spike. While it may not be as big of spike as you would get with a High II(insulin index) food, you will nonetheless get an insulin spike.

Jimmy Smith · 09-10-2006, 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ogedei

So I started taking creatine recently. I haven't done any loading, just a straight dose per day.

I have read that loading isn't necessary.

Can someone point me to some articles on this topic, or their own expriences?

Hmmm Maybe I shoulda posted this in supplements....Feel free to move it oh great god like moderators for JPfitness land!

Thanks,

Og.

Loading really isn't necessary. Check this study out
Muscle creatine loading in men

E. Hultman, K. Soderlund, J. A. Timmons, G. Cederblad and P. L. Greenhaff
Department of Physiology and Pharmacology, University Medical School, Queen's Medical Centre, Nottingham, United Kingdom. The effect of dietary creatine and supplementation on skeletal muscle creatine accumulation and subsequent degradation and on urinary creatinine excretion was investigated in 31 male subjects who ingested creatine in different quantities over varying time periods. Muscle total creatine concentration increased by approximately 20% after 6 days of creatine supplementation at a rate of 20 g/day. This elevated concentration was maintained when supplementation was continued at a rate of 2 g/day for a further 30 days. In the absence of 2 g/day supplementation, total creatine concentration gradually declined, such that 30 days after the cessation of supplementation the concentration was no different from the presupplementation value. During this period, urinary creatinine excretion was correspondingly increased. A similar, but more gradual, 20% increase in muscle total creatine concentration was observed over a period of 28 days when supplementation was undertaken at a rate of 3 g/day. In conclusion, a rapid way to "creatine load" human skeletal muscle is to ingest 20 g of creatine for 6 days. This elevated tissue concentration can then be maintained by ingestion of 2 g/day thereafter. The ingestion of 3 g creatine/day is in the long term likely to be as effective at raising tissue levels as this higher dose.

I prefer to to ingest a small amout of creatine several times per day.

Craig · 09-10-2006, 03:34 PM

LD, i wasnt' talking about sugar at all.

The research is clear. With three to four days of loading, you can maximize your creatine stores.

So if I can get something done in 3 days, why would I take 28 days to do the same thing?

Good quality plain creatine is cheap, so cost isn't an issue.

craig

Lost Dog · 09-10-2006, 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Craig

LD, i wasnt' talking about sugar at all.

The research is clear. With three to four days of loading, you can maximize your creatine stores.

So if I can get something done in 3 days, why would I take 28 days to do the same thing?

Good quality plain creatine is cheap, so cost isn't an issue.

craig

Excellent. I've been on the stuff for so long, loading's not really on my mind. When I started, the loading recommendation had more sugar than a pillowcase full of Halloween candy.

I've been taking 5g a day for years. I'm sure I'm topped out. Looks like I could lower down to 2g.

Is there any benefit to more that 2g? The bottle says 5g, some people say 10g, I've seen some recommendations over at t-nation for 5g every day, plus 5g in a pwo drink, CT recommends 5g up to four times per day.

It doesn't cost much, already, but think of how trivial it would be for people to take if they only needed 2g per day. That's less than 5 cents per day.