FRUSTRATION........ - JP Fitness Forums

slowerthanslow · 05-20-2006, 04:06 PM

Hi everyone! I post here once in a blue moon and its usually a similar topic but I just can't seem to find the solution. I do listen to, so its not that.
I am back because ya know how you can read things a million times and its the millionth and 1st that you go "ohhh, hmmm thats interesting."
Well here I sit having just read that lower carb and slow cardio no longer than an hour utilizes fat and faster cardio and/or more than an hour utilizes carbs. So if fatloss is the goal, lower carb and slow and no more than an hour of cardio.
Got it, so here's me (for those of you poor people that don't remember me and my last bout of posts) 5'5 weight ranges from 133-137. Muscular but pudgy distance runner. Diet basically consists of 65c,25p,15f. generally.
Have tried lower carb and higher protien but would always get sick. As in colds etc...could never run more than 3 miles if I was lucky and my usual mileage is 6-10miles. So it drives me nuts that I can be "burning all these calories" running all this mileage, lift upper body 3x a week and still be pudgy. I have a marathon in Oct and so part of says, screw it, since running is my first love, just run, eat and be pudgy. But trying on shorts and bathing suits this time of year brings me to tears....
HELP!!!!

emartin10 · 05-20-2006, 04:30 PM

That's not really correct. If you want to maximise fat loss, you'll want to read about interval training (go see anything by Craig Ballantyne). The basic premise is shorter, more intense spurts of cardio, with slower recovery in between. An example of an interval training workout:

2 minute warmup

1 minute sprint
2 minutes easy jog/walk

1 minute sprint
2 minutes easy jog/walk
.
.
.
2 minute cooldown

And the beauty of it is, you'd only have to go for about 20 minutes for a great, fat loss workout.

Hope this helps.

E

slowerthanslow · 05-20-2006, 04:36 PM

Thanks emartin. Yes, I've heard of and tried intervals and no I don't think I kept at it long enough to make a difference. Basically feeling like total and utter junk from cutting my carbs, I gave up because of lack of energy. If I decided to go back to intervals/HIIT and did that say 3x a week plus weights say 3x a week and did say 40c,40p,20f and did that for say how long, would I expect to see results soon?
Ok, ya know what, I don't wanna frustrate you guys. Here's what I'm looking for. I am a slowwwww distance runner. I feel I am pudgy, but I have some great muscle underneath the pudge. I want you to lay out a workout plan/cardio with an sample menu and how long I have to do it before I quit. I've been down this road before and got so exhausted and than sick that I quit. Oh and didn't see results either. How long did I do it for you ask? MAYBE 2 WEEKS...maybe slightly more, but not much.
I know myself well enough that low low carb is NOT for me, but I am willing to try lowER.

Kevin Larrabee · 05-20-2006, 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slowerthanslow

Thanks emartin. Yes, I've heard of and tried intervals and no I don't think I kept at it long enough to make a difference. Basically feeling like total and utter junk from cutting my carbs, I gave up because of lack of energy. If I decided to go back to intervals/HIIT and did that say 3x a week plus weights say 3x a week and did say 40c,40p,20f and did that for say how long, would I expect to see results soon?
Ok, ya know what, I don't wanna frustrate you guys. Here's what I'm looking for. I am a slowwwww distance runner. I feel I am pudgy, but I have some great muscle underneath the pudge. I want you to lay out a workout plan/cardio with an sample menu and how long I have to do it before I quit. I've been down this road before and got so exhausted and than sick that I quit. Oh and didn't see results either. How long did I do it for you ask? MAYBE 2 WEEKS...maybe slightly more, but not much.
I know myself well enough that low low carb is NOT for me, but I am willing to try lowER.

If thats what you are looking at go with Eric and check out Craig's turbulencetraining. Also check out the interview he did on The FitCast. www.thefitcast.com

http://www.turbulencetraining.com/

slowerthanslow · 05-20-2006, 04:51 PM

larrabee, thanks will check it out right now.

slowerthanslow · 05-21-2006, 05:59 PM

ok, so here's what I'm looking for. If I were to say eat 1800 cals of P+f, P+C meals 4-6 with higher carbs in the morn and around workouts.
Lift say 3x a week and do sprint intervals 3x a week for say 20 mins each.
Is that the right amount of cals and how long before you think I see results?

Kevin Larrabee · 05-21-2006, 08:22 PM

Thats about right, don't expect results in less than 2 or 3 weeks. And they will come slow, maybe 2 lbs a week if you have anything in check.

emartin10 · 05-22-2006, 02:13 PM

Yeah, patience is a virtue with weight loss. Stick with it, and you may not physically see results, but everyone around you will, your clothes will fit different, and the scale will move. Keep with it!!!

E

slowerthanslow · 05-22-2006, 02:38 PM

emartin and larrabee, thanks for the support so far.
This morning I warmed up walking for .75miles than sprinted .25, slowed to a walk for .25 etc...basically sprinted 400's with 400 cool down.
Did this for about 3.25miles total (including warmup) and than cooled down with a walk for a total of 4miles. Felt great.
My food today looks basically like a 40c,35,p25f.
tomorrow instead of intervals (as I think a day of recovery in between is good, yes?) I thought I'd try a straight short 3 mile run. Keeps my running interest, burns some cals but not too long as I tend to run and maybe I'll try and pickup the pace slightly more than my usual long slow distances. Maybe that to will stoke the furnace. I'm thinking something like this:

Runs will be 400's m,w,f with quickie 3 milers on th and fr and one 8 miler on saturdays and sundays off from running.
Weights will be 3-4x a week.

Food probably around the ratios I stated above with prot and carb switching ratios based on the day. Carbs focused in the morn and around workouts.

Question: my cals so far today are only 883 and I'm full and satisfied but again I don't want to fizzle out for my workouts. Unless I change something, by bedtime I will probably be around 1500 and thats eating more than originally "planned" I just can't believe how low the calories are coming together on fitday. At 5'5 and 136, shouldn't it be a bit more than that? Also do the cals from things like olive oil and other "add ins" just add in calories without much energy. Example, if I have 400 cals of olive oil, should I really be considering that as a fuel source? I know I need to include in calories for the day, but if my goal is to have enough energy to workout and not get sick, do I really count those?

emartin10 · 05-22-2006, 02:52 PM

I would say yes, those 400 cals from Olive Oil are definitely a fuel source, and should count towards your 25% fat intake. I would say that you are in a unique situation being an endurance athlete by nature and trying to go low carb. If you aren't getting fat loss results from the current ratio (say after a month or so), then tweak that ratio up a bit. If you are going to continue to do endurance workouts, you might not want to go too low carb at the risk of losing muscle mass. So play with the protein and fat, and see what works for your body.

If you are fearful of fizzing out during a workout, split your PWO shake into 2 or even 3 smaller servings, and have 1 serving before your workout, 1 during, and 1 after. That way, you aren't really increasing caloric intake, just distributing it more wisely.

Sounds like you have it figured out though. Stick with it, and you'll be good!

E

slowerthanslow · 05-22-2006, 03:14 PM

emartin, thats part of my whole problem is I can NOT continue the endurance training (40-60miles per week) and running and lose weight.
Thats what has me at such a loss. The only thing I'm keeping in for my own sanity is my once a week 8 mile run and that day I'll up cals.
But other than that long distances have not worked for fat loss.
So I"m trying to change my tune with the distances for now
in trade for fatloss.

emartin10 · 05-22-2006, 03:20 PM

Oh I understand. But, that said, interval training is the quickest, most efficient way to lose fat. I'm a triathlete, and have lost 14 lbs training - so it's possible with long slow distances, but it just takes a bit longer. If you want to keep the endurance events up, you just really really need to focus on the calories in, calories out. If you want to lose some fat real fast, then focus on intervals. It's frustrating, I know.

E

slowerthanslow · 05-22-2006, 03:32 PM

See now thats not fair (stomping feet!) How have you been able to train endurance and lose weight?!

emartin10 · 05-22-2006, 03:46 PM

I burn about 4000 calories a day in workouts, so couple that with my roughly 2500 cal BMR and it's really really hard to eat 6500 cals a day.

slowerthanslow · 05-22-2006, 04:37 PM

how do you have the energy though?
If I run alot and only eat 2500 cals I get sick/colds/rundown etc..

emartin10 · 05-22-2006, 04:42 PM

I don't only eat 2500 calories. I eat probably 5000 or so per day, but that's still a deficit of 1500 on a long training day. No matter how much I eat, I usually end up in a caloric deficit.

slowerthanslow · 05-22-2006, 04:54 PM

arrrrgggghhh! If I run, say 8 miles a day and ate 2000-2500 cals a day
I would get sick or would not have the energy. I would have to up my
intake and that (as it has) leads to no weightloss. Granted I can generally
eat alot and not gain from where I am but I don't lose the pudge I am dying to lose!

emartin10 · 05-22-2006, 05:10 PM

Try running 9 or 10 miles, then you can eat more. The ultimate key to weight loss is a caloric deficit, less in than you burn....

E

slowerthanslow · 05-22-2006, 05:51 PM

No, no no (laughing) I don't want to bore you with my whole story, but it appears as though the more I run, I don't lose weight. In fact, I gain some. If I try to eat more to fuel the runs, I gain weight. Great runs, fat body. If I cut cals, I get weak and ill. Thats my whole problem...for whatever reason, it apparently is NOT cals in cals out for me.
Everyone on weightlifting sites such as this one, insist its because I am running too much and not doing enough intervals. I have been told to cut wayyyyy back on mileage and JUST do intervals.