Fish Oil Supplements.....Your Thoughts Regarding Health

Clark · 02-16-2006, 11:10 AM

I'm studying an interesting topic in my Nutrition class here at the U of A currently, Lipids and their effects on health and what not. We have more recently just got to the Polyunsaturates, including fish oil. There is a whole section in my text associated with the risks of consuming fish oil supplements which has me a bit worried because I take fish oil on a daily basis.

Now I'm not disputing with the books main supposition that it is always better to get Omega 3's from whole food sources like Salmon and other fish but they basically go on to say that fish oil, taken in supplement form may be dangerous.

Included in their reasons are that they may raise LDL cholesterol, are made from the skins and liver of fish which may have accumulated toxins, they naturally contain high levels of Vit.'s A and D, and that they may suppress immune function.

My question for you guys is how much is too much, as it seems their focus is not actually on taking them but taking too much. This is something I will definitely address with my professor but I also would love to hear some input from you guys.

Marykaa · 02-16-2006, 04:18 PM

I wouldn't want to start a new thread for this.. but I also have a question.. so CLARK, if I may ask it here.. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

How many calories dose a fish oil capsule have?

Clark · 02-16-2006, 05:31 PM

9 calories per cap.

ZachL · 02-16-2006, 06:01 PM

well, 9 calories per gram of fat (any type), so it depends on the amount contained in the pill

Marykaa · 02-16-2006, 06:52 PM

Thanks!

Canadian_Bacon · 02-16-2006, 07:16 PM

Actually 9 cals/gram is an average. Short-Chain Fatty acids contain less(5-6) and MCT are probably closer to 7 cal/gram.

I believe I the nutrition text you are refering to and not all their information is valid.
On the fish oil thing. Most "fish oils" now adays are a concentrate and contain very little in the way of cholesterol, Vit A, and Vit D. Though having some fat soluble vitamins isnt a bad thing IMHO.

They are anti-inflammatory so TOO MUCH can inhibit immune response but what the book fails to mention is how much this actually amounts to. You would probably have to break 5 grams of EPA/DHA a day. The most concentrated oil most would ever by contains 600 mgs per cap. Therefore that would still be 8 caps a day which would be damned expensive.

Secondly, I did some searching and found no real research backing up the raising LDL statement under normal doses. Infact everything I have seen shows it IMPROVES lipid profile. If it raises LDL X amount but raises HDL Y amount and Y > X you are still probably better off.

Marykaa · 02-16-2006, 07:33 PM

Mine say

"1000 mg of marine fish oil" but then :
"300 mg EPA, and 200 mg DHA"

so what am I to understant with that?

Canadian_Bacon · 02-16-2006, 07:41 PM

You take fish oil for the EPA/DHA, that is all that matters.

your product is 60% EPA/DHA which is pretty potent and what I personally buy; a lot can be as low as 20% EPA/DHA(200 combined mg's per capsule). Anything THAT concentrated isnt just salmon juice so to speak. To get that much EPA/DHA they molecularly distill it which does a good job of removing any other contaminents.

If you are not treating anything in particular (inflamation problems, heart disease, etc) then probably 4 of those a day will do you good.

Marykaa · 02-16-2006, 08:04 PM

Me it's mostly for inflammations.. My left shoulder and right elbow.. just can't seem to heal. I'm sort of OK when I take Novanaprox-ec 375 mg.. but I try not to. I was taking just 2-3 fish oil caps until recently when I read that it was anti-inflammatory. A few days ago I upped to 6 a day.. (but I don't really have a "reason" why 6 and not 8 or 10, just that they are expensive)

Canadian_Bacon · 02-16-2006, 08:19 PM

6 is fine. I would not go over 5 grams EPa/DHA a day. That would be 8 pills. 6 is probably a good dose for your situation .

Bill2380 · 02-16-2006, 08:26 PM

Mine say 750-850 mg Omega 3s in a 1250 mg capsule. They say that the oil is refined to remove any toxins. They also claim to be a product of the "sperling", a small fish caught around Norway. The idea is that because it is a small fish with a short lifespan and lives in cleaner waters toxins do not accumulate. I take 3 caps twice a day in addition to 2 caps of red yeast rice twice a day. My total cholestoral dropped about 65 pts and I have much less joint pain since I started.

Marykaa · 02-16-2006, 08:29 PM

CANADIAN BACON.. was a lucky guess.. but I'm real glad for the reassurance.. thanks [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Clark · 02-16-2006, 11:08 PM

Canadian_Bacon

I agree with your assessment that the book fails to explicate in any way what "too much" fish oil is, especially in terms of EPA and DHA. I personally have the Kirkland Signature brand with 180mg EPA and 120mg DHA and take 8 a day. This adds up to around 1.5g of EPA and 1g of DHA plus any extra I get throughout the day from Canola Oil and Spinach.

I also was wondering how the hell LDL could be raised by taking them, seeing as they are anti-inflammatory in nature. I can definitely attest to this because my total cholesterol is 120.

The one unresolved issue I have is how the oil is put into the caps. My professor explained that the manufacturers use most of the "un-sellable" material from the fish, like scraps of skin off of the ground of boats to concentrate into the caps of oil. I will need to have a conversation with her about this and how it relates to the FDA and other reulations regarding the packaging and selling of the product.

Maybe you guys could help me build a case that might enlighten her regarding fish oil supplements (considering she has an obviously negative opinion of them), maybe she can shed some more light on the subject. Either way, amen to the open exchange of information and ideas.

Clark

Canadian_Bacon · 02-17-2006, 03:07 AM

Clark, as I am sure you are aware Consumer Labs tested like 30 popular brands and only found 2 that were not contimenent free or that did not meet label claims.

That says a lot IMHO about purity claims.

cappuccino · 02-17-2006, 06:53 AM

I guess one downfall of supplements, even ones that are good for you, is that they are not regulated. Many claims that might go un true..purity, levels of the actual supplement in the pill. I suppose that would be a case for getting the dietary needs from the actual product rather than a supplement.

OldGuy · 02-17-2006, 07:07 AM

http://www.wholehealthmd.com/refshelf/substances_view/1,1525,992,00.html

I thought this article was interesting. I was searching for the level of omega-3 in food sources and this article says there is about 2 grams in a 3 oz. seving of salmon.

But again, there is no level that is recommended.

BamaDave · 02-18-2006, 06:47 PM

A couple of people have mentioned how much fish oil they are taking per day, but I was curious about others as well. I have not taken these, but I eat a lot of salmon, use ground flax, and eat Omega-3-enriched eggs. I'm thinking about taking fish oil capsules and reducing my salmon intake because of concerns about mercury and other contaminants.

Lost Dog · 02-18-2006, 07:52 PM

I'd eat as much salmon as you like. There are downsides to everything we eat in this day and age. Mercury in fish (although salmon is not a long-lived fish, so not much mercury), pcbs, etc. Obviously, we can choose wisely, still. Wild salmon vs. farm raised salmon, chunk light tuna vs. solid white, etc.

Personally, I have my doubts about just how purified fish oil capusules are. Yet, I'll keep taking them and eating salmon.

I can get my protein from more chicken or beef, but they're filled with Omega-6s. Don't want more of those...

BamaDave · 02-19-2006, 01:12 PM

You've got that right, Lost_Dog -- nutrition often seems like a "damned if we do, damned if we don't" kinda thing...

I actually use a lot of canned salmon. Another reason I would like to reduce my consumption is because I'm trying to work on my sodium intake. I've had blood pressure problems in the past, and excess salt is one of my leftover vices.

cappuccino · 02-19-2006, 01:18 PM

The canned salmon is probably a good choice (well except the salt) cause you can get the wild kind. I think honey boy or johny boy is the brand.

I guess it all goes back to everything in moderation?

BamaDave · 02-20-2006, 07:57 AM

I currently have Double Q canned salmon, which is supposed to be wild Alaskan. Who knows for sure, though. Maybe they're farmed in the "wilds" of Alaska?? [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

Speaking of salmon, my local Wal-Mart was selling gift boxes of smoked salmon yesterday for $1 each!! I guess they were leftover from Christmas. I grabbed three of them. Of course that's not exactly low in sodium!

And speaking of salt -- I have been making an effort to dramatically cut back on my intake for the past couple of days. It's not as difficult as I thought -- if I use other seasonings and a little lemon juice on veggies. I swear I feel better already - but that could just be my imagination. OTOH - I am a classic saltaholic and use way too much in my cooking, so it could be a real effect. I also noticed that I look "vein-ier" after cutting back on the salt. OK, I guess I'll stop steering the thread off topic!

cappuccino · 02-20-2006, 07:40 PM

Yeah, if you start weaning yourself from added salt when cooking, you'll stop missing it. You just have to get used to how the food actually tastes. :P I used to be addicted to garlic salt, and I still love it on home grilled steaks. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

oh,fish oil (to get back on topic [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] )

Canadian_Bacon · 02-20-2006, 08:04 PM

If you are taking in more sodium just make sure you balance it with a little extra H20. Also, it has as much to do w/ the ratio of your sodium/potassium as it does the absolute quantities so make sure you eat your potassium rich fruits and veggies!

BamaDave · 02-21-2006, 09:11 AM

I've been very good about water, fruits, and veggies for a long time, but my blood pressure (cystolic) still seemed a little high at times. When I had my physical last week, the first time it was taken it was 130/75, and the second time it was 124/75. Those aren't terrible numbers by any means, esp. compared to my typical readings in the 140's/90's back when I was overweight and not exercisiing regularly. Nevertheless, I feel like with the healthy diet I eat and the volume of exercise, especially the running, it should be lower. Interestingly, I checked my BP yesterday evening after a couple of days with reduced salt intake -- 114/70 and 115/70!

Cappy, I agree about getting used to the taste of the actual food instead of mostly salt. But it's not as hard as I thought it would be. It's a learning experience -- oh, this is what these taste like! LOL. Last night I cooked a tuna steak and seasoned it with a salt-free chipotle pepper seasoning mix plus some lime juice and a little bit of pineapple juice from a fresh pineapple. It was great - I didn't even miss the salt.

I've also noticed that my AM weight has been down by several pounds for the past two days - that has to be due to reduced water retention.