TdF: Drugs

[Ogedei]

http://za.today.reuters.com/news/New...S-20060727.XML

Comments, thoughts? Curses?

[Mountain_marc]

The French are it again! Always have to prove that someone beating them is on something.

[Mark57]

I saw that earlier, really sucks. I wonder if it could be natural?

This report has a few more details, not much but a little. Landis is, of course, denying any knowledge. I think after a bad day, a couple beers and a hummer from the wife would boost my testosterone/epitestosterone ratio too.

[BeachHead]

Jeez....I am losing all hope for sports.

[ODB]

I'm tired of this stuff. I'm really tired of preliminary reports being released before they have solid proof of wrong doing. Maybe the US should just boycott the Tour next year. We can take our OLN and go home. Freakin' French media!

[Mark57]

Yeah, that's the only thing that pisses me off. They still need to test the B sample and the rider is entitled to a counter analysis. No one will ever remember if the B is clean or if the counter clears him, "Landis tests positive" is all that matters now. This is absolute bullshit. If he doped then he needs to be sanctioned, but releasing it to the press at this point should be criminal.

[Brady]

Originally Posted by Mark57

Yeah, that's the only thing that pisses me off. They still need to test the B sample and the rider is entitled to a counter analysis. No one will ever remember if the B is clean or if the counter clears him, "Landis tests positive" is all that matters now. This is absolute bullshit. If he doped then he needs to be sanctioned, but releasing it to the press at this point should be criminal.

Unless, I have read incorrectly his team made the announcement not the Tour or the testing agency

[Kaiser]

Yep. His team suspended him and the UCI was doing the testing. The French may have leaked the story, but they didn't create it (this time). I hope the second sample comes out clean because this would be very bad for the sport.

------------------------------------------------
Steroid Speculation Swirls Around Landis
High Levels of Testosterone Found in Tour Champ
By STEPHEN WILSON
AP Sports
LONDON (July 27) - Floyd Landis' stunning Tour de France victory just four days earlier was thrown into question Thursday when his team, Phonak, said he tested positive for high levels of testosterone during the race.

Landis Awaits the Next Test Result

The team suspended Landis, pending results of the backup ''B'' sample of his drug test.

The Swiss-based Phonak team said it was notified by the UCI on Wednesday that Landis' sample showed ''an unusual level of testosterone/epitestosterone'' when he was tested after stage 17 of the race last Thursday.

''The team management and the rider were both totally surprised of this physiological result,'' the Phonak statement said.

Efforts to reach Landis were not immediately successful.

Landis made a remarkable comeback in that Alpine stage, racing far ahead of the field for a solo win that moved him from 11th to third in the overall standings. He regained the leader's yellow jersey two days later.

Landis rode the Tour with a degenerative hip condition that he has said will require surgery in the coming weeks or months.

Arlene Landis, his mother, said Thursday that she wouldn't blame her son if he was taking medication to treat the pain in his injured hip, but ''if it's something worse than that, then he doesn't deserve to win.''

''I didn't talk to him since that hit the fan, but I'm keeping things even keel until I know what the facts are,'' she told The Associated Press in a phone interview from her home in Farmersville, Pennsylvania. ''I know that this is a temptation to every rider but I'm not going to jump to conclusions ... It disappoints me.''

The Phonak statement came a day after the UCI, cycling's world governing body, said an unidentified rider had failed a drug test during the Tour.

Phonak said Landis would ask for an analysis of his backup sample ''to prove either that this result is coming from a natural process or that this is resulting from a mistake.''

Landis has been suspended by his team pending the results. If the second sample confirms the initial finding, he will be fired, Phonak said.

USA Cycling spokesman Andy Lee said that organization could not comment on Landis.

''Because it's an anti-doping matter, it's USA Cycling's policy not to comment on that subject out of respect for the process and Floyd's rights,'' Lee said. ''Right now, we have to let the process proceed and we can't comment on it.''

Carla O'Connell, publications and communications director for the U.S. Anti-Doping Agency, said: ''I'll make this very brief: No comment.''

Under World Anti-Doping Agency regulations, a ratio of testosterone to epitestosterone greater than 4:1 is considered a positive result and subject to investigation. The threshold was recently lowered from 6:1. The most likely natural ratio of testosterone to epitestosterone in humans is 1:1.

Testosterone is included as an anabolic steroid on WADA's list of banned substances, and its use can be punished by a two-year ban.

Landis wrapped up his Tour de France win on Sunday, keeping the title in U.S. hands for the eighth straight year. Lance Armstrong, long dogged by doping whispers and allegations, won the previous seven. Armstrong never has tested positive for drugs and vehemently has denied doping.

Speculation that Landis had tested positive spread earlier Thursday after he failed to show up for a one-day race in Denmark on Thursday. A day earlier, he missed a scheduled event in the Netherlands.

On the eve of the Tour's start, nine riders - including pre-race favorites Jan Ullrich and Ivan Basso - were ousted, implicated in a Spanish doping investigation.

The names of Ullrich and Basso turned up on a list of 56 cyclists who allegedly had contact with Spanish doctor Eufemiano Fuentes, who's at the center of the Spanish doping probe.

Associated Press writer Michael Rubinkam in Allentown, Pa., and AP Sports Writer Arnie Stapleton in Denver contributed to this report.

[UpNorth]

Any conspiracy theorists out there? Could it be that Phonak is pushing this story public so they can resign his contract at a cheaper rate? He is (or will be soon) as free agent.

[emartin10]

Well, his testosterone levels were actually low, it was the ratio of testosterone/epitestosterone that were a bit off. I've read a few places (John Eustice's column) that says he thinks it's a false positive. And Phonak suspended him because he's under investigation, just like Basso and Ullrich were suspended before there was any solid proof.

I have faith, but it's starting to wear thin...

E

[Mountain_marc]

emarti: Do you have a link to that column?

[Ogedei]

I don't know enough about doping to really render an opinion. Obviously it would be better if he didn't.

On that stage he overcame a lot and pushed through and overcame, if he is clean it is possible that the mere fact he was able to do it, to put out that much effort, could have possibly thrown his body out of wack.

Stranger things have happened.

Og.

[Mountain_marc]

Like Mark57 said: even a hummer from your wife could alter your testosterone count. I'm positive this will all get cleared up.

[emartin10]

Here is the release from Phonak's website:

English

The Phonak Cycling Team was notified yesterday by the UCI of an unusual level of Testosteron/Epitestosteron ratio in the test made on Floyd Landis after stage 17 of the Tour de France.
The Team Management and the rider were both totally surprised of this physiological result. The rider will ask in the upcoming days for the counter analysis to prove either that this result is coming from a natural process or that this is resulting from a mistake in the confirmation. In application of the Pro Tour Ethical Code, the rider will not race anymore until this problem is totally clear. If the result of the B sample analysis confirms the result of the A sample the rider will be dismissed and will then pass the corresponding endocrinological examinations.

Please understand that we cannot at this time give you more detailed comments.

E

[Mark57]

The douchbag sports anchor on the local news last night said that Landis had tested positive for "extremely high levels of testosterone". Nothing like reporting the facts I guess.

I'm still giving Landis the benefit of the doubt until the B sample test, and even then I'll wait to see if a counter analysis can determine if the test was natural or artificial.

Not only do I not suspect Landis of doping, but I just don't think he'd be that stupid. The stage winner is ALWAYS taken to a testing tent for a sample immediately after they get off the bike. So if you were doping, would you think it was a good plan to ride away from everyone on a hard mountain stage?

[Mark57]

This is why the premature release of the initial test results is so wrong:

http://www.velonews.com/news/fea/10600.0.html

Testosterone 101
By The Associated Press
This report filed July 28, 2006

Questions of possible use of a banned steroid by Tour de France champion Floyd Landis were raised because of a urine test that spots elevated levels of performance-enhancing testosterone.

The test detects both testosterone and a related steroid called epitestosterone, which is not performance-enhancing. Both are produced by the body and are also made in synthetic form.

Landis's Phonak team said his urine sample showed "an unusual level of testosterone/epitestosterone" when he was tested after his amazing come-from-behind performance in the 17th stage of the race on July 20. The usual ratio of testosterone to epitestosterone is about 1 to 1 or 2 to 1, said Gary Wadler, a physician and member of the World Anti-Doping Agency.

Suspicions of improper steroid use arise when the ratio climbs above four parts testosterone over one part epitestosterone, Wadler said. Officials have not said what ratio Landis's test showed.

Andrew Pipe, a physician and medical and scientific adviser to the Canadian Centre for Ethics in Sports in Ottawa, says that synthetic testosterone is normally injected, but taking it in the middle of an athletic competition would have little effect in boosting performance.

"Anabolic steroids, of which testosterone is the granddaddy, can have a central nervous system effect," he said. "But anabolic steroids largely work by increasing the capacity for training and increasing the bulk and tolerance of muscles. That isn't going to happen in a few hours.

"The effect of the testosterone is not going to be experienced unless there's a very significant training endeavor associated with it as well."
Pipe cautioned that the initial uproar over the high levels of testosterone detected in Landis's system may prove to be premature, depending on the outcome of additional testing that will have to be carried out before a definitive judgment is made. Taken by itself, he said, an elevated testosterone finding in the rider's A urine sample is enough to raise suspicions, but it does not automatically implicate the athlete as a doping cheat.

"I think it's very important that people take a deep breath and understand the implications and significance of what's being reported," Pipe said last night. He said that some men have naturally high levels of testosterone. For this reason, Pipe said it is imperative that the levels found in Landis during the Tour de France be compared with testosterone levels that have been detected in drug tests that have likely been carried out in the past on all the riders, not just Landis.

If no such comparable data is available, Pipe said, the rider will have to be tested again in the future. For this reason, Pipe said he was surprised that the findings from Landis's A sample have been made public. "The last thing I would want is for the suspected athlete to know that we're on to the fact that he or she may have an unusually high TE ratio and that we may have to administer further tests."

[ODB]

Thanks for the info Mark. Our local paper, which buried coverage of the TdF throughout the race on the back pages of the sports section, ran this story big and proud above the fold of the sports section this morning.

Landis, cycling await results of 2nd test

http://www.arkansasonline.com/ShowSt...tion=PrintText

Assholes!

[Ogedei]

You should write the editor about that. Ask why if the sport itself only gets shit coverage how come the drug allegations get front line?

[Mark57]

I sent an email to the TV sports guy, and I posted a comment on Lou's blog. But I can understand that with all of the doping allegations in cycling how this would seem to go unquestioned.

[ODB]

For those interested in the history of doping at the TdF:

Tour De France Doping Timeline

(Jul 28, 2006) 1903
In the first stage of the inaugural Tour de France, Hippolyte Aucouturier retired with stomach cramps. He had been dosing himself throughout with draughts of red wine.

1924
First real drug scandal, when the Pelissier brothers admitted using everything from chloroform, cocaine, aspirin and "horse ointment" . "In short, we run on dynamite."

Post Second World War
Riders start using the amphetamine pills that were given to soldiers. The great Italian legend, Fausto Coppi, said he used speed, "only when I have to." And how often is that? "Almost all the time."

1967
England's Tom Simpson died on the slopes of Mont Ventoux during the 13th stage. He had taken amphetamines and alcohol, a combination which proved fatal when coupled with the hot conditions, the notoriously hard climb and a pre-existing stomach complaint.

1968
Sparked by the death of Simpson, the Tour de France starts drug testing.

1978
Michel Pollentier used a sample of someone else's urine. Tour officials tell Pollentier he's drug free, but also pregnant -- he had used his wife's urine.

1980
Dutch rider Gert-Jan Theunisse is busted for the second time in two years. He is allowed to continue on a technicality. The peleton goes on strike saying he should be banned.

1998
Banned drugs, including blood-boosting EPO, found in Festina team car. Festina is kicked out of the race. Top cyclist Richard Virenque is banned for nine months. Riders stage protest over drug raids.

1999 Giro d'Italia
Tour de France and Giro champion Marco Pantani of Italy is expelled while leading race after failing a blood haematocrit test.

2002
French police arrest the wife of Lithuanian rider Raimondas Rumsas. She claims the testosterone, EPO and steroids are for her ailing mother. Rumsas, who finished third in the Tour, denies doping products were for him.

2003
American sensation Tyler Hamilton finishes fourth despite a broken collarbone. He is banned from cycling in 2004 for drug use.

2004
Five riders, including Briton David Millar are kicked out on doping charges. Millar returns in 2006 and places 59th.

2005
French police question Italian rider Dario Frigo before the start of the 11th stage in the Alps after finding performance-enhancing drugs in a car driven by his wife.

August 2005
French sports magazine L'Equipe claims to have proof that seven-time Tour champion, Lance Armstrong uses EPO in 1999. Armstrong denies and "scandal" fizzles.

July 2006
Pre-Tour is rocked when Germany's 1997 Tour winner Jan Ullrich and Giro d'Italia champion Ivan Basso, are named in Spanish drug investigation. Both denied any involvement. Nine riders leave the tour.

2006
American Floyd Landis wins the Tour. After a sluggish Stage 16 race, Landis re-claims the lead on the 17th stage with a stunning comeback ride through the Alps.

2006
Four days after the Tour, Landis tests positive for testosterone. The sample was from his Stage 17 ride. Landis's B sample has yet to be tested but the race was beset by doping problems before it started.

SOURCES: cyclingnews.com, guardian.co.uk, CP files

Legal Notice: Contents copyright 1991-2005, The Hamilton Spectator. All rights reserved. Distribution, transmission or republication of any material from www.thespec.com is strictly prohibited without the prior written permission of The Hamilton Spectator. For directions on material reuse, website comments, questions or information send email to helliott@thespec.com.

http://www.hamiltonspectator.com/NAS...=1112274690734

[emartin10]

John Eustice brought up another good point today. Floyd was tested multiple (3 or 4 times) before stage 17, and then 2 more times AFTER stage 17 - and no results after stage 17 have been released. No tests prior to that stage were positive. A spokesperson from the ACSM today said that in order for testosterone to work, he would have had to be shooting up for weeks before the Tour. So those previous tests would have come up positive as well.

So either he shot up before stage 17 (would he really be that STUPID?????) with mutant testosterone that works instantly, or it's a false positive. They need to look at his tests after too. Sounds to me like they are fishing over there in France. Sorry we dominated your sport yet again, GET OVER IT!!!!!

E

[UpNorth]

This article in the Chicago Tribune

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports...-sportsnew-hed

mentions that he could have been shooting up for sometime but he could have botched protocol he was following to mask the illegal activity. That's the first time I saw that option and in a way it makes sense. That or that the sample was tampered with are really the only options. The article also mentions the 11-1 ratio which is WAY above the acceptable levels of 4-1.

Results of test B should be out soon...

[kuri]

John Berardi wrote a good blog post on the Floyd matter: http://www.johnberardi.com/

[emartin10]

Thanks Chris, that's a great great article. I'm glad someone with some knowledge is inputting information, because all these dopes on TV have no clue what they are talking about. Guilty or not, it's at least good to know what you are discussing before passing judgement.

E

[Dogmama]

Sample B is positive. Bummer. Still don't understand how he could have a one day huge spike in testosterone - the experts say it isn't possible. Hope he fights it.

[RobertT]

Whether it's because he's been taking the stuff all along and forgot to mask it, or because he tried overloading on it for a possible one-time boost, the fact is that he has tested positive x2. And it pisses me off to no end. Not because he's an American and I loved the idea of Armstrong being followed up by another American winner (I reserve the right to root for the athlete of my choosing). No; what pisses me off is that to all accounts he's a cheater. And I'm heartily sick of cheaters in sports, any sport, not just cycling, and not just doping.

We see it everyday. Athletes committing on-purpose fouls or penalites and/or acting as though the referee's/umpire's call is wrong, even though they surely know that the call is correct. When's the last time anyone saw an athlete get called for something and simply acknowledge the offense and admit guilt? Or perhaps in a gentlemanlike manner ask the official something like, "Are you sure?", and when confirmed act like a sportsman and accept the call. Both are pretty rare.

It's all the same thing: Doping in cycling or intentionally grabbing a receiver after five yards and acting like nothing untoward took place, or arguing a call at second base when everyone in the park knows you're out. I call it a lack of sportsmanship. Or, simply, cheating.

Not cheating doesn't mean you're not trying. Hell, I give 100% to everything I do, but if the ump calls a strike or says I'm out, well, that's that. I'm not going to pretend he's wrong if I think he may be right, and if I'm pretty sure he's wrong I'll still accept his decision.

Are we teaching our kids to be good sports or to win at all costs?

Anyone ever read/hear about Bobby Jones, one of the greatest golfers of his era, admitting to unintentionally moving his ball even though no one else noticed the event? That's how a sportsman acts. Follow the rules and play as hard as you damn well can to beat the heck out of your opponents. But first follow the rules.

Did Landis follow the rules? It sure looks like he didn't, all the hyperbole aside. Don't get me wrong...even though I knew it wouldn't, I was hoping hard that the B test would negate the A and I could relax. Is it okay that Landis cheated just because the entire sport does it? Not in my opinion.

I tried to stay on-topic here, respecting the fact that this thread is about cycling and Landis. But I firmly believe that it's representative of a general malaise toward cheating in all sports. I think we need to teach our children that working hard, practicing, and focus are the ways to win, not playing outside the rules.

[Patricia]

RobertT - that was an excellent post.

[emartin10]

I agree with you Robert about cheaters. I'm tired of it too. I don't understand why everyone is making a big deal of this B sample though. If they knew cycling, they would a) realize that the B sample is the same as the A, same urine, same day. Everyone knew it would come up positive. B) Phonak HAS to fire him in order to stay in UCI's good graces. They still support Tyler, and they'll still support Floyd. C) There is still a LONG appeals process, and that's where Floyd will be vindicated, if he is. The French are assholes, and will always give the Americans the short end of the stick, hence, he is not the TdF champ. In my mind, nothing has changed today from yesterday, and if he is innocent, he has a lot of splainin to do.

E